[Chris1617]

Originally Posted by TruthWillSetUFree

The Wingmakers material resonated very deeply with me as does Lyricus and I meditate at the event temples a few times daily.

I do not see myself writing a paper like you did, I did purchase yours by the way chamber 17, it was excellent, very well done and informative. It enabled me to view the painting in an entirely new way. Thank you.

How can one continue to evolve with the materials without doing an in depth paper?

Hi TWSUF,

It is not necessary to write papers like I did to continue to evolve with the materials. That is what happens with me but we are all different. Just immersing oneself fully in the material with the intent to come to learn what the truth is regarding our reality -- and the material itself -- should suffice. That's how I started and worked till 2001. This requires intense research (of whatever kind one is inclined) because there are many metaphors mixed in with the material making it material one cannot just accept or believe in at face value if one is honestly and rigorously searching for the truth.

I would also suggest that the research will likely be far more rewarding transformational wise and personally if the research is intended for more than oneself. I wrote my papers so certain answers would be there for all to benefit from if they wish. I did not start out my research of the WMM in this way, but when I realized I had to decode some of the paintings' meanings, it was not for myself alone, but for Mark Hempel and everyone else investigating the materials.

Having said this, there are IMO catalytic images and semiotics within the paintings that greatly assist in the transformational process.

I do not recommend anyone just accept what I have written, but rather question all I have written in the greatest detail. This will ensure the reader's, or researcher's own immersion, and consequent development of their own fluid intelligence as they find even more or greater truths, because I have not, by any means, written the last word on these paintings, and I'm sure there must be some errors somewhere within my texts.

In the first discourse, it said we are not able to have transformative experiences in our human instrument.

Teacher: Haven't I just told you you cannot experience this state in the human instrument?
From Lyricus First discourse

So if we are not able to have them, how can we/you have the kundalini experience you spoke of?

This is also further explained within the early philosophies. The real Transformation is experienced only at the Sovereign Integral level. What the human instrument (HI) experiences is but a slight breeze from the greater transforming storm at the Sovereign Integral level.

In the transformation that the HI experiences s/he does not experience the Sovereign Integral (Sov Int) state or what the Sov Int actually is. That is just too far removed from the human domain.

There is another paper of James' entitled The Living Truth (I cannot find the link and it may not be open to the public yet) in which James relates the story of a young musician who wants to compose a piece of music so divine it will give anyone who listens to it this experience. The young man eventually has this experience, which is not quite the way he expected. So there is an example there of someone having this experience, this time via a musical lifelong commitment to help others.

You will note he -- and if you look around the world to all who have had this experience it is the same for them all -- wished this for others rather self. Others have had similar experiences while engaged in total absorption on some project for the benefit of all.

There is an accompanying feeling of, "Yes. This is what I have to do. This is fantastic. This is my destiny. This will help everyone." It is partly because of these thoughts that there is no personal thought of the transformation when at this stage. That is just not important. What you are doing is so interesting, engaging and fulfilling that nothing else really matters, not that one ignores daily duties; in fact they are probably performed with greater gusto and enthusiasm than ordinarily because one is in "real time" so to speak, where one is really alive.

It is usually at this time that transformation occurs, if it is to occur. The WMM, however, seems to provide a pathway whereby anyone can experience some degree of this transformation usually at a more general pace, because it is so loaded with biological catalysts. For example:

"The neurobiology of consciousness"
from
http://protoscience.wikia.com/wiki/L...kers.2FLyricus

Biologists such as Francis Crick [6] have suggested that all of the information-processing capacities normally attributed to souls can be accounted for by conventional physical processes that take place within brains. According to this view, the commonly held idea that souls can have some existence beyond the conventional materials of the human body is an illusion, also traceable to conventional brain physiology and brain-generated experiences.

The Wingmakers material points to the same part of the brain that people such as Crick have suggested is important for human consciousness. "There is within the thalamocortical system what scientists refer to as the reticular thalamic nucleus (nRt). It's widely accepted by neuroscience that nRt plays a vital role in the judicious regulation of the flow of neural information between the thalamus and cortex. What is not understood is how specific sensory information (light frequencies, sound frequencies, rhythmic synchronization, ULF, symbolic images) can influence how the ILN and nRt systems inter-operate to form a hybrid functional cluster that enhances fluid intelligence and accessibility to the Genetic Mind." (source: see question 1 at this webpage)

I have been working on attaining this state for years, not to have it like a prize rather as a consequence from all the work I do on my shadow aspects, letting go all that is not me, or my pure state, to transcend my ego, but now I am confused hearing this.

I know it is not something we earn or work for it sort of just happens. It should also not be the focus of ones spiritual practice, But why does Lyricus state that it is impossible?

I'm not so sure you don't work for or earn it. It is, in simple terms, very much a Eureka experience. It would seem illogical for that to happen with no input by oneself.

There could be many reasons why the teacher says what he does to the student. To mention just a few:

1. It is only a very small section of the populace that ever experience this, just as it is only ever a small section of the populace that excel at anything specific, be it playing the piano, or performing scientific or mathematical research. The teacher may sense that this person is not such a one and that for him he is wasting his time thinking about it.
2. There may be greater needs and goals for this person. These still might be spiritual in nature, but different in kind.
3. He may be so far from this experience -- even given it will happen in his lifetime -- that again it is pointless thinking about it at this time.
4. He may have any number of weaknesses that need attending, like a lack of concentrative ability, or lack of ability to focus clearly on one subject to plumb its depths, or make some breakthrough. In which case he will need more general training in meditation and other disciplines before he will be able to trigger this experience through providing some meaningful service to others in a breakthrough of some kind; or again he may just be the type of person who is to experience the changes in a gradual manner, and these are by far the majority and there is essentially nothing less or more about either way.

Also, I have a feeling that James is Dr Neruda. Have you ever felt that too?

I answered this earlier under St Clair's thread (here or at Camelot) before the site was reorganized. Perhaps it is in the archives somewhere or maybe those private pages were erased.

I did once so think, yes, but James is not Neruda. I had to change my initial paper 6 to reflect that back in 2001. In the original, published at Osaka University of Arts I had to enter errata notes in the bulletins because it was printed from the aspect of the two of them being the same person. Oopps! On one level Neruda may function as a metaphor for James in as much as both represent the "messenger" and the one who gets the information on the Web. In the story Neruda is now an old man, however, whereas James is fairly young. Mark was quite insistent that they were/are two different people and I realize now -- and since 2001 -- that they indeed are different. The AA Book is full of metaphors.

When all of your interests in life come together within your work for the public, others, or the world, whatever it is, the transformation will be at your door; but you won't be aware of it because you'll be having such a wonderful time. So don't worry about it. Maybe yours will come at the Event Temples or somewhere else where you find yourself one day unknowingly totally fulfilling yourself because you are so absorbed in what you are doing for everyone.

A pleasure to talk with you TWSUF.

Chris



I hope to hear from you soon.

Love & Light[/QUOTE]