Old Project Avalon Forum (ARCHIVE) - View Single Post - Capitalism, Sustainability, and the Possibility of Global Collapse

doodah · 10-12-2008, 09:02 AM

historycircus -- I think I understand why you say what you've said, and I suppose China might not have understood the emptiness of the dollar. Perhaps.

But the real physical effects of globalized industry, that they surely must have understood. After all, the US has demonstrated the results of modern industrial processes for over 50 years. So China went ahead anyway, with the same processes. I'm not aware that they've done anything differently, and the effects are the same -- polluted air, poisoned water. I've never understood why they did that.

As to the monetary stuff, it's true that nobody understands modern finance, including all the people who talk about it.

Here's a very interesting analysis of modern economics:

Economic Models explained with cows...

TRADITIONAL CAPITALISM
You have two cows.
You sell one and buy a bull.
Your herd multiplies, and the economy grows.
You sell them and retire on the income.

SOCIALISM
You have two cows.
You give one to your neighbor who has none.

COMMUNISM
You have two cows.
The State takes both and gives you some milk.

FASCISM
You have two cows.
The State takes both and sells you some milk.

NAZISM
You have two cows.
The State takes both and shoots you.

BUREAUCRATISM
You have two cows.
The State takes both, shoots one, milks the other, and then throws the milk away.

SURREALISM
You have two giraffes.
The government requires you to take harmonica lessons.

AN AMERICAN CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You sell one, and force the other to produce the milk of four cows.
Later, you hire a consultant to analyze why the cow has dropped dead.

THE ANDERSEN MODEL
You have two cows.
You shred them.

A FRENCH CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You go on strike, organize a riot, and block the roads, because you want three cows.

A JAPANESE CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You redesign them so they are one-tenth the size of an ordinary cow and produce twenty times the milk.
You then create a clever cow cartoon image called 'Cowkimon' and market it worldwide.

A GERMAN CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You re-engineer them so they live for 100 years, eat once a month, and milk themselves.

AN ITALIAN CORPORATION
You have two cows, but you don't know where they are.
You decide to have lunch.

A RUSSIAN CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You count them and learn you have five cows.
You count them again and learn you have 42 cows.
You count them again and learn you have 2 cows.
You stop counting cows and open another bottle of vodka.

A SWISS CORPORATION
You have 5000 cows. None of them belong to you.
You charge the owners for storing them.

A CHINESE CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You have 300 people milking them.
You claim that you have full employment, and high bovine productivity.
You arrest the newsman who reported the real situation.

AN INDIAN CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You worship them.

A BRITISH CORPORATION
You have two cows.
Both are mad.

AN IRAQI CORPORATION
Everyone thinks you have lots of cows.
You tell them that you have none.
No-one believes you, so they bomb you and invade your country.
You still have no cows, but at least now you are a Democracy.

A NEW ZEALAND CORPORATION
You have two cows.
Business seems pretty good.
You close the office and go for a few beers to celebrate.

AN AUSTRALIAN CORPORATION
You have two cows.
The one on the left looks very attractive.

ENRON VENTURE CAPITALISM
You have two cows.
You sell three of them to your publicly listed company, using letters of
credit opened by your brother-in-law at the bank, then execute a
debt/equity swap with an associated general offer so that you get all
four cows back, with a tax exemption for five cows.
The milk rights of the six cows are transferred via an intermediary to a
Cayman Island Company secretly owned by the majority shareholder who
sells the rights to all seven cows back to your listed company.
The annual report says the company owns eight cows, with an option on
one more.
You sell one cow to buy a new president of the United States, leaving you with nine cows.
No balance sheet provided with the release.
The public then buys your bull.

10-12-2008, 09:02 AM	#111
doodah Avalon Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 373	Re: Capitalism, Sustainability, and the Possibility of Global Collapse historycircus -- I think I understand why you say what you've said, and I suppose China might not have understood the emptiness of the dollar. Perhaps. But the real physical effects of globalized industry, that they surely must have understood. After all, the US has demonstrated the results of modern industrial processes for over 50 years. So China went ahead anyway, with the same processes. I'm not aware that they've done anything differently, and the effects are the same -- polluted air, poisoned water. I've never understood why they did that. As to the monetary stuff, it's true that nobody understands modern finance, including all the people who talk about it. Here's a very interesting analysis of modern economics: Economic Models explained with cows... TRADITIONAL CAPITALISM You have two cows. You sell one and buy a bull. Your herd multiplies, and the economy grows. You sell them and retire on the income. SOCIALISM You have two cows. You give one to your neighbor who has none. COMMUNISM You have two cows. The State takes both and gives you some milk. FASCISM You have two cows. The State takes both and sells you some milk. NAZISM You have two cows. The State takes both and shoots you. BUREAUCRATISM You have two cows. The State takes both, shoots one, milks the other, and then throws the milk away. SURREALISM You have two giraffes. The government requires you to take harmonica lessons. AN AMERICAN CORPORATION You have two cows. You sell one, and force the other to produce the milk of four cows. Later, you hire a consultant to analyze why the cow has dropped dead. THE ANDERSEN MODEL You have two cows. You shred them. A FRENCH CORPORATION You have two cows. You go on strike, organize a riot, and block the roads, because you want three cows. A JAPANESE CORPORATION You have two cows. You redesign them so they are one-tenth the size of an ordinary cow and produce twenty times the milk. You then create a clever cow cartoon image called 'Cowkimon' and market it worldwide. A GERMAN CORPORATION You have two cows. You re-engineer them so they live for 100 years, eat once a month, and milk themselves. AN ITALIAN CORPORATION You have two cows, but you don't know where they are. You decide to have lunch. A RUSSIAN CORPORATION You have two cows. You count them and learn you have five cows. You count them again and learn you have 42 cows. You count them again and learn you have 2 cows. You stop counting cows and open another bottle of vodka. A SWISS CORPORATION You have 5000 cows. None of them belong to you. You charge the owners for storing them. A CHINESE CORPORATION You have two cows. You have 300 people milking them. You claim that you have full employment, and high bovine productivity. You arrest the newsman who reported the real situation. AN INDIAN CORPORATION You have two cows. You worship them. A BRITISH CORPORATION You have two cows. Both are mad. AN IRAQI CORPORATION Everyone thinks you have lots of cows. You tell them that you have none. No-one believes you, so they bomb you and invade your country. You still have no cows, but at least now you are a Democracy. A NEW ZEALAND CORPORATION You have two cows. Business seems pretty good. You close the office and go for a few beers to celebrate. AN AUSTRALIAN CORPORATION You have two cows. The one on the left looks very attractive. ENRON VENTURE CAPITALISM You have two cows. You sell three of them to your publicly listed company, using letters of credit opened by your brother-in-law at the bank, then execute a debt/equity swap with an associated general offer so that you get all four cows back, with a tax exemption for five cows. The milk rights of the six cows are transferred via an intermediary to a Cayman Island Company secretly owned by the majority shareholder who sells the rights to all seven cows back to your listed company. The annual report says the company owns eight cows, with an option on one more. You sell one cow to buy a new president of the United States, leaving you with nine cows. No balance sheet provided with the release. The public then buys your bull.