[franzBardon]

Originally Posted by Richard T

Hello franzBardon

There is a measure of reality because the forces that manipulate the mind of man could not just lie. People would not get on board. So the forces hook the mind with something that resonates strongly at the mental level. The disinformation part comes then with what resonates strongly with the lower registers, using emotions and spiritual longing.

Effectively, you are right that I speak from my frame of mind. If I was a master of words, I would be able to speak from my frame of reference in a way that would not be perceived as such but rather perceived perfectly from within the personal frame of reference of each individual who 'listens'.

Whether I do for a fact know I am correct or not is not as relevant as for you to know if yes or no I am. In the end, it is for the individual to know.

I am absolutely against the concept that anyone should 'accept' someone else being correct. So I do not go from the point of view that anyone should accept me being correct. What I am saying though is that everyone should really listen to what people say. Not compare to what they already figure they know. Because what somebody truly knows cannot be unknown. The knowledge cannot be undone. Only illusions can be undone.

So that therefore, only illusions are challenged when confronted with something other than what we may believe we know. And that challenge creates unease.

Listening is not a psychological exercise. It is a state of neutrality that excludes judgement and that is very active, rather than passive.

So that someone who takes for granted another person's statements is acting as a sponge.

An active listener can then, once the table is turned around, force the registers to go a notch higher, and this becomes constructive opposition.

Judgemental listening brings the opposite, which is systematic opposition.

So, either I am making hypothesis or I am speaking truly. In the first case, which means I am wrong, so long as the person who listens, (reads, of course, in the present case) does not believe, but merely examines what is said without prejudice, that person is safe from being wronged. The person is not influenced. One day, that person can always say that I had a good deal of imagination. But of course, if it just happened that I was not speaking from imagination, then that person would have had a great advantage to consider what was being said.

The premise of human psychology is founded on the assumption that If I cannot know, therefore no one can know. It is based on the projection that the ego makes that all are as we are now and always will be. But what if it was not the case? One day, someone would tell us something fundamental and we would dismiss it.
The reverse is true with people who are spiritual and hoping for a 'message'. If someone makes statements that are in line with what we project from our psychology, we presume they must be right, and the more people do, we assume that 'we' are right.

Nut I say it is neither.

So, I am not asking anything of anyone. What I am taking, is the right to say what I would and do so in respect of whomever would read. I would not impose what I say like I would not accept to be imposed.


Yes, I am saying that ultimately any omission of information is disinformation. Or it is a form of lie, in the measure that the information is used against someone's own advantage. Omission of information can be made to protect as well. But... In time all must be said.

I am not charging Mr. Deagle with anything of the sort. I do not attack people, I examine what is put on the table and its vibration.

My position is that the mind is already under control. The mind is conditioned both by rationalized memories and by forces that act beyond the mind to suppress what man, technically, already knows beyond his memory. Therefore information is witheld and replaced with limitations. It is only via the creative opposition process that the limitation can be effectively pushed back at the moment.

" a man that believes in nothing will likely fall for anything"
That is an oxymoron franzBardon. How could he fall for anything if he does not believe in it?

"belief cannot remain unchanged. some beliefs may prove to be an obstacle but, nothing more."
This is interesting.
Beliefs cannot remain unchanged, this is right.

Once an illusion has lost its hold, it cannot stand. The ego then feels a loss and quickly searches for something to replace it that will be better adapted to his heightened condition. Because any loss of a belief is attached to an increase in vibration. He will then search for forms that better conform to his new vibration state and accept the form as some sort of new found truth. Each belief then becomes a plateau where the ego will remain for a time, feeling comfortable with himself. When the vibration changes again, the belief becomes unsatisfactory as it does not conform to the vibration, and the cycle continues. These changes of vibration normally come with opposition in life. They can also come with the coming of a fom of a higher order that 'illuminates' the mind and automatically replace the previous belief in a process of impression that we could call the 'eureka' process.

The ultimate increase in vibration then would be to bypass all beliefs to avoid standstill situations and disallow the vibration to settle in the comfort of a belief.

A belief is a format for the mind and not a definitive answer. The human experience has been led by beliefs and we see the culminating resuts today. Beliefs are so powerfully ingrained in man, because of the vast memory of his race, that the shock required to increase his vibration for him to pass onto another totally different way of being will have to be great, and certainly unsurmountable to many.

"creation is an incredibly precious gift, that everything is connected for the source IS the same"
Ok
I say that creation is a power of authority that comes with the integration of the energy of the source with the energy of man. The power of creation is not a psychological wish and power is not something freely given by those who hold power. And, power is not given to a consciousness that has the ability to use it for domination.

"love is the means & language to & of our unification. now with regard to love, it may or may not be the means & language to and of our unification with the whole but, that belief will change, deepen as i evolve (ascend higher in the planes). is that thought, that belief poisonous to my being or my mind? of course not."

Consider this for a moment and let me know how you feel about what I will say:

There is no love on this planet. And there won't be so long as the concept of love will remain a means to obtain something. Love is not egocentric. It would be better termed as the real and factual ability to put oneself in someone else's shoes. But we instead look at the shoes and think they are not shined properly.
Man's love is shoestring love. It is, like all things, something else he wants for him. It is something else he wants to bring him something.

Love, like will and intelligence, is a fundamental energy that emanates from the core of the universes. Like will and intelligence, love does not belong to an individual, it is only accessible. And to access those energies, what man wants must be the same as what those principles want.

If man wants those energies in relation to what he believes, what those energies psychologically mean to him, they will remain out of his reach. Because he would use them according to the distortions of his beliefs, that already are conditioned by the laws of domination.

Man has progressed technologically. But he is the same as he was psychologically. Man cannot project reality out of his historical errors. This implies that his psychology must go and be replaced with something totally different. Not something that slowly evolves into something else but something radically other than what it was. Otherswise, the very basis onto which his psychology is based, which is a reflection upon his errors, will simply progress in its form but on the same foundation.

About the subconscious.

The subconscious is unconsciousness. It effectively a conduit through which forces infiltrate themselves to affect the 'conscious' entity. But is that entity really conscious since most of his psychic territory is under the rule of the so called 'subconscious'?

This radical change in consciousness will require the eradication of all that is unconscious in man. This means the full recuperation by man of his psychic territory, which in turn means closing the door to any force that would influence him this or that way.

Emotionally induced spiritual concepts are not higher levels of vibrations. They are within the limited scope of the astral of the planet. And what is heaven to us would be hell for other intelligences.

Man wants to be receptive to whatever goes through his dial.

I wil go back to the principle of love for a moment if you don't mind.

Love is for man, not for the forces.

And to insure that this will become a reality, the forces are going to **** man off so much that he will have no choice but to start hating them. And it is this hatred that will give them the will to increase their vibration and become somehting real, something that cannot be influenced, something that can say 'I am'.

Those forces will **** man off so much that he will lose all spiritual illusions and will turn his eyes towards those, who like him, got caught in the anus of the universe that is this planet.

The love of the invisible makes man corruptible to the forces that dwell there and of whom man has no idea.

And they will present themselves as vibrations, as emotions, as forms of light, and they will manipulate man, because man gives them all the power over him because he loves them. And it is man that man must love. So that one day, when he leaves this solar system, he is in position to enforce horizontalization of the balance of universal energies that to this day have always been heirarchized vertically, at the expense of the material races.

This is what love will be for.

"t is true human beings have been conditioned in numerous ways but, have the capacity (the potential) to overcome many forms of it if they apply themselves. having an active understanding of what frequencies (vibrations) are and how they function especially in relation to ones self is essential. knowing how to use them is incredibly important. "

I concur with this statement of yours.

The potential is there. And for the potential to become reality, the forms must be exploded to allow the energies they condition to be freed.

Man is a potential, until he becomes a reality. The two stages are quite distinct.

To conclude this post, I do not expect anything of the reader, and I do not ask anything of him.

The first protection is to not believe. This already is an answer that is worthy in itself, since the greatest threat against humanity comes from those planes that know perfectly how to manipulate perceptions.
This is not defeatist. It rather is more like telling the fish that his salvation does not come from what is hanging at the end of the hook.

thankyou for your response richard. i'd like continue our discussion.

you begin your response by stating, "there is a measure of reality". it is unclear how you are using the word measure. measure as in the process of estimating the magnitude of an individuals experience of reality vs. that of the non-reality?

"...because the forces that manipulate the mind could not just lie...". do u mean malevolent forces or forces that simply influence human beings? since you used the word "lie", in association with the "forces" it appears to be the case. do not also planetary forces as well as spiritual forces influence the individual on the mental plane? do not planetary, spiritual, and malevolent forces all influence the manner in which an individual experiences "A" reality?

"...The disinformation part comes then with what resonates strongly with the lower registers, using emotions and spiritual longing." you share the tools the malevolent forces use to manipulate the emotional & spiritual longings of an individual, because these are among the most deeply rooted in a human being. however, your explanation of disinformation, "...Disinformation can be considered as any distortion, any coloration, any partial information (meaning partly retained information), anything that lets the mind imagine potential outcomes." is quite general so we can then also include planetary & spiritual forces that also operate and powerfully influence the human being.

now, if one were to look at the definition of disinformation in most, if not all, western dictionaries they would see that disinformation is the deliberate act of an individual to disseminate deception to another to: prevent, dissuade, mislead, and redirect them to one's own course of action. would not this definition be more conducive to your statement regarding these malevolent forces you ty to describe? is it not the case that by forces you mean entities? so again for clarification purposes we need to have a common understanding with regard to who or what these forces are.

who controls the ego?

"...anything that lets the mind imagine potential outcomes."
what of prophecies, psychic premonitions, psychics, project looking glass? all disinformationists?

i ask you what is the process by which one raises their vibration?
this is something very important for the reader to be attentive to.

if the law of correspondence is applied, we would see we (and all beings, entities), have the ability to create similar to our creator however, we differ given the density which we are at presently.

in my last post i stated : "creation is an incredibly precious gift, that everything is connected for the source IS the same, and that love is the means & language to & of our unification." this is because the act of creating is one of the most powerful tools granted( precious gifts) to human beings and all things created for that matter. you reply:

"OK, I say that creation is a power of authority that comes with the integration of the energy of the source with the energy of man. The power of creation is not a psychological wish and power is not something freely given by those who hold power. And, power is not given to a consciousness that has the ability to use it for domination."

i did not say nor imply the act of creating is a psychological wish or something given or held by anything other than THE source. we are not discussing power. the ACT of creating is a gift all created things, including human beings, have ALREADY been given. creating is a mental ACT which draws upon both the masculine & feminine natures within each being, entity, and thing. this exists on all levels of the material, mental, and spiritual planes. this is law.

in response to your reference to the premise of human psychology, you state :

" The premise of human psychology is founded on the assumption that If I cannot know, therefore no one can know. It is based on the projection that the ego makes that all are as we are now and always will be."

again, your observation is very broad. there are a number of hypotheses related to what the premise of psychology is founded for there are many many schools of thought. an example behavior, is measurable and can be changed thru the application of various behavior principles. now, if we look to carl g. jung's biography, from what it appears you've borrowed from, he explores the question of what premise is psychology founded upon. he recalls a dream in which case he found himself in a house he knew was his but, did not know. the house representing his psyche . he does not however, come to the conclusion that because he did not know his psyche , "no one else could. [know their own]". i have yet to come across a text which arrives at the conclusion you state so i ask you where have you gotten this or
or how have you determined this?

i concur, "love does not belong to an individual it is only accessible."

human beings are conduits. it is our senses that allow us to recognize it's existence. you state, "love is for man not forces." did man create love? we certainly ascribe attributes to it.

did human beings create harmony?
when things harmonize are they in agreement?
what is the sensation (feeling), recognition of things vibrating together agreeably called? is that not love?
if all things vibrate together agreeably do they not ascend higher and higher? is this not the most powerful ability of created things?


would it not be more beneficial to just state the principles and laws which govern all things created so that human beings can recollect the knowledge (tools) to know them selves, evolve, and defend them selves from the suggested malevolent forces? it was mentioned previously that you had direct experience. i'm not sure what the means exactly. it is apparent to me that you have borrowed information from both psychology and other occult arts. may i ask what affiliations you have to any of the mystery schools?

there are still several subjects i'd like to discuss in time.