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Reincarnation/Timeline Question
I have tried to collect and assemble information regarding reincarnation (outside of dogmatic spreadsheets) and apply it to timelines using the multiple universe theory. Ok, stay with me here, a question arises which this forum could help me/us a great deal.
Postulate #1. If Billy Miers (sp?) is correct, then according to the Pleiadians have suggested the reincarnation of the soul is 156 years (this could be off a couple of years, but is not pertinent to the question). Postulate #2. If David Wilcock is correct, and I believe he is, and he is the reincarnation of Edgar Casey, did he graduate to this (our current) timeline? Question. Edgar Casey died in 1945, yet David Wilcock was born much sooner then the 156 year suggestion from the Pleiadians. If #1 is true, then we all graduated to this timeline. From this assumption more questions arise, such as "how many times have we taken this current timeline?" If we didn't, for example, pass the 4th grade we wouldn't be moved forward to the 5th. Using this analagy and applying Billy Miers' information there is a gap that doesn't compute. Running along side the aforementioned paradox, I ponder how many times I personally have been born to this timeline as my presence in it suggests I have either (1) graduated the prior timeline; or (2) failed this timeline before. My instinct tells me I have been here before and need to do or learn something now in order to move forward. Any thoughts to clear a muddied mind is greatly appreciated. Peace |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
According to Billy Meier, we have an overpopulation of souls in the spirit realm waiting to be incarnated. So the time spent in the spirit realms around Earth could be less due to souls waiting to incarnate. It seems that there are many changes happening in the spirit realms that are adjusting to the overpopulation of Earth as well.
So, if David is the reincarnation of Edgar Cayce, he may have incarnated quicker because he is needed here now for the Earth' transition to ascension. Peace, Kevin |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
just a note about mier/george green etc
they all support de population as from their "nordic/pleidian" sources does anyone else find it strange that blonde enlightened aliens seem to only talk to other blondes or swiss/german people? st clair claims to be working with nordics and talks about his "bloodline" being celtic and thinks palin with her bloodline should rule and claims iran and russia are working with pleidians and the US is working with greys. st clair/billy mier/g green all think the planet needs to be thinned out, who else's agenda does that sound like? put two and two together. Quote:
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Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Thanks for the reply's.
While a linear timeline can provide a comfortable and familiar baseline, I am drawn to the John Titor phenomenon when I consider multiple timelines/multiple realities. At times I find it easier to count sand at the beach then consider multiple realities; but I digress. I enjoy David's website and love his work; logical and thought through absent of any agenda sans his service to others. It could be the timeline he left is not the same as this one we find ourselves in; and therefore would not be needed to reincarnate sooner than what is assumed constant. Yet his attachment to his memory of that influencial life/timeline boggles my brain. Which, by the way, is showing its limits more frequently. My convictions about what I know continue to elude me. Is anyone familiar with Richard Rose? www.richardrose.org I enjoy most those threads which give me more than just predictions and opinions. |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
In my opinion time is a measurement used by us within this universe and not elsewhere. This is why it creates such a paradox. Different timelines points to different realms/dimensions where accounts talk of doubles of ourselves existing. What if there is a copy of you in every infinite universe? Would that point us to an idea that our soul isnt just here but experiencing the same life elsewhere with different rules? Perhaps we are not primarily on this earth?
Macros |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Today you'll find at least 10 woman who will claim that they where Cleopatra.
Probably you will find 10 Mark Antony, to match. Reincarnation belongs to the mind, who thinks we'll live forever. Idea of reincarnation is planted, in order to stop us think about our own mortality. It's false second, third, fourth ...... chance |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Sylvia Browne says some take a long time to reincarnate, others turn right around and come right back--mainly because there is some unfinished business to attend to. Maybe David had some unfinished business to attend to here as Edgar Cayce and needed to finish it up.
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Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
They are all right in their own worlds.
Time is an illusion as is any form of separatism. Of humans, aliens and every other energy bearing being in the multitude of infinite universes. We were ALL Cleopatra. And Jesus and Hitler. Those humans in this historic run of time (on earth) recall the "big" names more easily because it took so much energy to manifest the BEING within the human flesh. Think how much energy and concentration it took to aid Jesus with the walking on water. IMHO anyone who has a BIG energy and thus a massive following is most likely a vast collection of spirit vibrating at the exact frequency. Hence the reason so many claim to have been Marilyn Monroe, or Da Vinci. Who's to say they weren't? The notion of time lines is bogus from my viewpoint because time isn't LINEAR. Ever. Every thing taking place right this second is altering time's course in an infinite number of universes and NONE of them. Just my buck 42. :-) |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
True the time is linear in this state of our collective consciousness, yet by shifting consciousness on the different position, you'll realize that there is no time at all. Both perceptions describes certain positions of our own consciousness, so therefore both are right.
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Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Billy Meier and the Plejaren actually said that the time between incarnations would naturally be approximately 1.5 times the life just lived, not 150 years. This natural law has, however, been broken due to the tremendous overpopulation here calling on spirits to incarnate earlier. Billy has said that now spirits are incarnating at between 10-70 years after the previous incarnation.
This creates problems because not all the previous lifetimes lessons and experiences are integrated into spirit before the next incarnation. Billy and the Plejaren say we should have a population of just over 500 million for this planet. They advocate a slowing down of births to achieve this over a period of time, not reducing the number of people currently in existence which would be murder and against the law of Creation. Time lines are a non issue here IMO as it is the amount of earth time in years, not where or on what line, that is under consideration. It is the spirit that reincarnates not the person. Each person is totally different in incarnation. For example, Edgar Casey's personality only exists within the endless All That Is (WingMaker terminology) or the storage banks (Meier's terminology). It has been completely dissolved and integrated into the spirit that inhabited Casey's body. If "Wilcock is the reincarnation of Casey" it would be more correct to say that the Spirit that inhabited and gave life to Edgar Casey has incarnated in the body of Wilcock. It is the nameless spirit that continues on, not the person. Each person ends at death with the dissolution of the body, brain and mind. Macros, we are primarily on this earth. "We" are personalities that we have a conscious awareness of. It would be the soul or spirit that incarnates in many places and times or in parallel dimensions or universes, not the conscious "we". We are here...unless we go somewhere else, in which case we will not be here. A person with a soul/spirit can only be in one place at one time. There are not multiple identical spirits the same anywhere. If your spirit were to have an aspect of you in another dimension that "you" would actually be different with different experiences and so the spirit too would differ. The two different spirits could only come together at the death and dissolution of the individuals as the spirits were absorbed into the collective or Sovereign Integral that they derived from and return to. Wilsone7, we have had countless incarnations or previous lives. Meier says we incarnate into the physical realm over a period of approximately 6-8 billion years before permanently graduating from the physical. I am not in any way convinced of John Titor's story. Chris |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
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ACTION EFFECT 1 Meaning 0 ACTION EFFECT 0 Meaning 1 EATING SEEDS IS A PASSTIME ACTIVITY, I SCATTER SEEDS INTO GRAVESYARDS WITH TEARS in my Eyes. BLESSYOU, XXXX |
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It is quite common for someone to take on the identity of a powerful personality. Don't children sometimes imitate the strong parent? Also, I am aware of a part of my overself that is in the body of a woman who lives in Chicago. As a spirit being, how many bodies am I capable of using at the same time? Also, please consider this: sometimes people cannot confront their own past life mistakes and traumas and so they seek to glorify it instead. sometimes people want to deny past lives entirely because they don't see any value in going there. Before I got serious about knowing the whole truth of my past lives, I too glorified myself. I glorified in being a queen, a warrior, a composer, a bedouin. But once I got back to before the beginning of my timeline I saw that I was nothing more than a simple loving being with immense potential. No body, no titles, just a glorious nothingness. The rest of the timeline was the attempt to express myself as "Potential". Even though my trip down the timeline is grueling at times, I wish that everyone could know about themselves the way I know about myself. love and joy, Gnosis |
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In reference to David Wilcock being a reincarnation of Edgar Casey it may be that David's soul-mind is a reincarnation of another aspect of the same Over Soul-Mind as Edgar Casey's. Plus, I believe re-incarnation is not 'linear'. A soul-mind from 'this' time-line may reincarnate into another time-line which is either a time past or a time future (and vice-versa, a soul-mind from the 'future' may reincarnate into a time-line which could be represented as a 'past-time'). Could be why you feel you've done this before. :wink2: All the Best Ara |
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From my understanding the 'mind' is not dissolved at death. :original: The Soul-mind of that 'person' absorbs/assimilates the personality and is itself then reincarnated. As you stated, the personality doesn't reincarnate, it is the soul-mind which does. At this moment your Soul-Mind is experiencing a "human soul-mind evolution" meaning that your experiences of being Human are perceived by the parameters of what it means to be 'human'. Your soul-mind may have previously incarnated into another type of soul-mind evolution, such as Zeta or what ever. That 'experience' would also have been assimilated into your Over Soul-Mind. Many different Beings (soul-minds) incarnate into 'human form''. Each add important contributions to mankind physically, psychically, emotionally and spiritually. All of these contributions assist with the evolution of the human soul-mind. All the Best Ara |
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The problem of our insufficient language is ever with us, so bear with me here. I am going to presume that by “soul-mind” you mean “Soul-Mind” where “soul” equates with the individuated spirit within which is a singular part of Source yet forever connected to Source and Mind as the over Mind (as distinct and different from the human mind) or Sovereign Integral in WingMakers terminology, or Over Soul/ aka Oversoul. While the Oversoul can have lives in many times and dimensions, this is different from our personal spirit's lives and evolution. For the personal or individuated spirit to evolve and progress upon each death and assimilation of all the frequencies of all lessons and experiences of that lifetime, Source guides the spirit to its next necessary experience. It is highly unlikely, if not impossible, these will be either in the far past or the far future as Source will see its best course as a logical and coherent progression in all aspects of evolution. This means that a spirit does not incarnate in a time or situation vastly different from its own evolutionary level. The spirit of you and I will therefore not IMO incarnate next in the past because it has had the experiences it needs from the past and -- most importantly -- the frequencies of the planet in the past are not in harmony with the spirits of today. Simply put, we have evolved beyond the past. To over simplify the analogy it would be like a NASA space scientist being made to go and live with a tribe in the jungle, which is not only unnecessary it is wasteful: he can better serve at NASA; and the tribesman can better serve in the jungle. Each has their place, so too, the past and future, otherwise evolution would be a chaotic mess. The same, according to Meier, goes for the future: The future earth is of a higher frequency, more advanced, and our spirits need to evolve up to that level before they can incarnate there. It would be only a very advanced spirit that could in theory incarnate in our future e.g. a more advanced being in every respect from somewhere else in the cosmos that e.g. came here and accidentally died here; but even that spirit will have to wait for the planet’s frequency to catch up with its own before an incarnation could take place, and as time as such doesn’t matter to Source or the spirit it is a mute point. This is another reason why intergalactic species do not mix en mass with other species lower on the evolutionary scale, like on this planet, on an open and free basis: there is so much at stake if something goes wrong. In fact it is for this very reason that the change in our planet's frequency is occurring IMO; because we have some such spirits here waiting, which have enabled the frequency jump to be made earlier than it otherwise would have. According to Meier there were over 100,000 such beings on the spaceship that, after mechanical failure, self-destructed over Tunguska in the early twentieth century. These spirits, along with the natural evolution of the planet, have significantly raised the frequency around this planet IMO. James (of WingMakers, Lyricus, and Event Temples) has also indicated that it is the presence of an influx of souls/spirits from elsewhere in the universe that are essentially responsible for the planetary frequency raising we are about to experience. These are very difficult subjects for most to grasp, especially so because we have no scientific proof of them as yet. IMO the reason people think such future and past incarnations are possible is because we are moving closer to the Sovereign Integral frequency all the time and identifying with it, and from Its perspective that is how things can appear; but that is because it is beyond this time system and sees and experiences it all as one. We and our individuated spirits are in a different situation -- currently. Déjà Vu, IMO only relates to brain activity. It’s a very curious phenomenon, and I once experienced this for an entire afternoon, which was a very uncanny experience, but it relates more to feelings of familiarity and memory in the brain triggering in and causing it. The brain and mind do strange things like this as we know from many reported cases, and especially illnesses (not that déjà vu is an illness) how strange connections in the brain can and do frequently occur. Spirit is immaculately intelligent, because it is guided always by Source, and it never guides itself to experience the same thing twice, just as there are no two spirits identical, no two experiences are identical; if a human lesson needs learning again there will always be subtle differences at least; exactly the same lesson would likely lead to exactly the same result and a broken record syndrome. Everything living is wonderfully unique in its existence. Nice discussing with you Ara, Chris |
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The "Soul-Mind" as you put it orchestrates the existence of potentially thousands of different lives throughout space and time and somewhere in time there could be a Zeta and other beings etc. As you say all of these experiences will be absorbed into the Soul-Mind, but the Soul-Mind is not the individuated spirit at the center of our individual human existence. The Soul-Mind lies beyond our individuated spirit, but of course, connected to it. The Zeta experience, to use your example, would not be the experience of my individuated spirit that animates the person here typing this to you, but of the Oversoul or Sovereign Integral that looks over all the individuated spirits it uses to gain its experience across universes, dimensions and time. As you say, they do assist in evolution, but of the Oversoul/Sovereign Integral rather than that of the individuated spirits on other missions from the Oversoul/Sovereign Integral. It is highly likely that my individuated spirit has experienced human existences on other worlds before coming here. This would, however, have been millennia ago. According to Meier, and I tend to agree with this (contrary as it is to the ideas of many New Agers), there are certain gravity energies that keep spirits in the vicinity of the planetary system where their human instruments have died, and one can only really incarnate on another system by going there physically and dying there. The individuated spirit is then part of the planetary frequency. The latter will effect when the new arrival can actually incarnate in human form again. IMO most of us have lived many lives elsewhere before coming here to colonize this earth, but they would have been long ago, and because we are now approaching that technological level again we are "remembering" "things" from then. I am quite convinced that science will eventually prove it an impossibility that a near past life of ours was in another galaxy somewhere; but they will find we originated in another galaxy and had many experiences there before coming here. Each individuated spirit evolves according to the experience of the humans it inhabits. As you probably know, this is the purpose for the human existence. It is when a human experiences the higher levels of transformation that they gain glimpses to the Sovereign Integral level. This is a very rare experience indeed and most currently find great difficulty in just connecting with their individuated spirit for its insights and guidance from Source. The Sovereign Integral or Overself is vastly removed from the human domain, yet just a cosmic breath away. Any being with an animating spirit is a human being. There are such Zeta human beings and there are mere androids that are not human beings from Zeta. The experiences of androids it would seem are not assimilated into any individuated spirit or Sovereign Integral. The Sovereign Integral is the collective spirit whereas the individuated spirit is the spirit that animates our current lifetime. There are times when it helps to remember the difference. Enjoy your weekend Ara, Chris |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Interesting reading. Some of the terminology was unfamiliar to me.
I'm only going to report my observations along these lines -- this from about only 200 hours of sessions, both myself and my hubby. BTW, I had a great session today and went back over a quadrillion number of years to look at myself. This is part of a sequence of negatively charged incidents and the practical purpose of looking at all of this is to clear myself of my compulsions to have something to the point of alienating others. It's working, and I also get a little insight into how things work. When we have sessions we look at not only the pictures but also the energy masses that beings carry around with them. The mind is such a conglomeration of energy masses. Still the mind, kill the mind, discreate the mind. The being may or may not need a mind, but he sure can make one up whenever he wants. Some things spoken in this thread are still a bit too sublime for me, but I enjoy reading. The body is also a conglomeration of ridged up energy masses and our bodies are getting lighter as we make progress. Less mental mass too. I once saw a disembodied "human" who had a lot of grey stuff surrounding him, so we take it all with us. Not all gets activated though, from lifetime to lifetime, but it's all there from lifetime to lifetime, unless someone knows how to and proceeds to make the effort to get rid of that "grey stuff". The reason that "grey stuff" is not your friend is because it controls you and not the other way around. Some of the Tibetans practice necromancy and that could be used in other places to draw a being back to another place other than earth, or at least keep some of his attention there. We have seen whole planets of beings killed off and they generally mull around the dead planet feeling pretty low until someone comes along and starts asking them some questions or they somehow get up enough wattage to recall themselves. A couple of brighter ones might shoot off first and go off in space and get attracted to some nearby asteroid or planet. Eventually they do sort themselves out and one way or another find a planet with lifeforms and start the action all over again. Overall, yes, I agree that we are earthbound from lifetime to lifetime, but it is possible to expand our awareness. I am happy to be here to the extent that I am aware of being larger than here, is the best way I can describe it (thanks to my PEAT facilitator). |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Very interesting explanation Chris.
بنی آدم اعضای یک پیکرند که در آفرينش ز یک گوهرند چو عضوى به درد آورد روزگار دگر عضوها را نماند قرار تو کز محنت دیگران بی غمی نشاید که نامت نهند آدمی Human beings are members of a whole, In creation of one essence and soul. If one member is afflicted with pain, Other members uneasy will remain. If you have no sympathy for human pain, The name of human you cannot retain. Alternative translation by Dr. Iraj Bashiri: Of One Essence is the Human Race, Thusly has Creation put the Base. One Limb impacted is sufficient, For all Others to feel the Mace. The Unconcern'd with Others' Plight, Are but Brutes with Human Face. - Sa'di of Shiraz |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
It looks like the quantum physicists are proving that out.
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I got a couple of questions about this subject, maybe someone can enlighten me (And other readers.).
What makes a certain soul connect to a certain body? Or is it a crab shoot, first soul that establishes a connection , is first to get the body kinda situation? Is it the DNA resonance Frequency, that enables a soul to connect? Is the Nerve System working as a 3 dimensional Antenna that only resonates with a certain soul and its frequency? Why would a soul after being released of its 4 dimensional chains come back here for a bonus ride in what at this moment can be perceived for most as hell, but with the potential to become heaven for all? I can not remember ever have been here, And seeing history, I would have never volunteered for a new ride... (History repeats and stuff.) I can not imagine with multiple universes to explore in an infinity of time and space, that I would come back here, and see if it could have gotten any worse then it was.. Or would linger around to pester people as a ghost... The SciFi channel series Ghost Hunter, is imo full of it, because if they would have really found something, then it would have been CNN/ABC/MSNBC material proving the afterlife beyond a doubt. Any answers or speculations, or profound statements known that were made by experts on the subject? Thanks in Advance. |
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[QUOTE]We have seen whole planets of beings killed off and they generally mull around the dead planet feeling pretty low until someone comes along and starts asking them some questions or they somehow get up enough wattage to recall themselves. A couple of brighter ones might shoot off first and go off in space and get attracted to some nearby asteroid or planet. Eventually they do sort themselves out and one way or another find a planet with lifeforms and start the action all over again.[QUOTE/] Basically this is just as Billy Meier explains it. If a planet is destroyed the spirits that were "bound" to that planet can stay there in waiting for millenniums if change may come or they may travel to or be drawn to the nearest possible place of habitation to continue their evolution. Quote:
Most definitely so. |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
TranceAm,
I got a couple of questions about this subject, maybe someone can enlighten me (And other readers.). What makes a certain soul connect to a certain body? Or is it a crab shoot, first soul that establishes a connection , is first to get the body kinda situation? Hi TranceAm, I'm going to answer in green this time: I think you mean "(the four letter slang word for excrement beginning with c and ending in p that doesn't come up due to moderator editing) shoot" as in gambling. According to Meier and the Plejaren it is Creation itself or Source in WingMakers terminology that guides the spirit to its next incarnation. It does this according to natural law and no one can explain exactly how it is determined (how Creation/Source works in this way). It just knows where is best for the Spirit's next incarnation, and, to use an analogy, just as water finds its own level the spirit finds its own level of humanity that will best satisfy or present the lessons and experience it now or next needs. It does this in an all encompassing consciousness way. There is no actual thinking about it as Source doesn't think, like we do. Is it the DNA resonance Frequency, that enables a soul to connect? Is the Nerve System working as a 3 dimensional Antenna that only resonates with a certain soul and its frequency? This is a very interesting question. All frequencies and energies in the universe are essentially spirals. Of course each human parent has their own individual DNA and genetic structure and these are going to influence greatly the incoming spirit's human instrument or personality that will house it. My own opinion here, at the moment, is that the spirit, at our level, has only a very rudimentary personality, if that. According to Meier again, it is only after graduating from the physical incarnation sequence of lives that the spirit takes on its own unique personality. We are all in the process of developing this spirit personality over the span of billions of years. The spirit does have its frequency, however, and so IMO it probably enters a human instrument where it's frequency is in at least some degree of harmony with the DNA and genetics of the coming human personality's host insofar as it is one of the deciding factors along with, environment, likely experiences to encounter, and other factors that Source or Creation will "assess" as it directs spirit to its next incarnation. The human instrument or personality can and does affect the inherited DNA and genetics to certain degrees and levels depending on how it lives and the choices it makes; and how it responds to the promptings of Spirit within. Some of the DNA and genetics are adaptable and some are not, so it's a remarkable "decision" that Source/Creation makes, or "escorted guidance" it performs. Why would a soul after being released of its 4 dimensional chains come back here for a bonus ride in what at this moment can be perceived for most as hell, but with the potential to become heaven for all? For its own development and evolution. We learn most things through making mistakes and errors and going through trials or challenges of some sort or another. It is sometimes said that the most advanced of souls have the hardest of times or most difficult challenges, but this is not always the case. Some may come just to perform a helpful function and be in less need of spiritual development than others, though all are forever developing and evolving in spirit. The Plejaren say Billy Meier is the most evolved spirit on this planet, even galaxy and universe (I cannot of course verify this, nor do I necessarily believe it) as he has returned from the level closest to Creation it is possible to reach before one is absorbed forever into it; yet he has had to experience the hardest of lives with at least 21 assassination attempts on his life and immense challenges and trials. As the mission becomes bigger the challenges increase. Of course, we are also here to experience the beauties and wonders of existence too. It's not all trials but basically they are certainly part of it and necessary for the spirit or soul's evolution. There is a saying along the lines of "Trials or challenges maketh the man." Trials test our spiritual mettle, or how much we let spirit guide our lives so we can fulfill its function of expressing Source/Creation on the planet to bring the "heaven for all" that you mention. Depending how the individual deals with the challenges and trials the soul/spirit evolves -- or not. As it evolves and as mankind learns to listen to it and bring its frequencies into daily life just so do we bring that "heaven to all." I can not remember ever have been here, And seeing history, I would have never volunteered for a new ride... (History repeats and stuff.) Source has greater wisdom than we do, and it guides us -- or our spirit -- back here for our spirit's own development. Not many children would volunteer for school but they are made to attend and later in life most realize that, "Yes, it was for the best that I had an education even given all its faults and imperfections." You don't remember being here before because you haven't; it is your spirit that has been here many times before. Each personality is new and experiences life fresh which is why there is no memory of previous lives. The continuum is through spirit alone, so any memory of past lives, which is actually very difficult and quite rare to witness comes through being attuned to pure spirit and from there on into the Sovereign Integral state and on into the previous life. I think it is far rarer to experience than many new Agers imagine. It is too easy to be deluded by the subconscious and imagination here and to then conclude or think it is happening. It can be done but IMO is more difficult than seeing the future which merely requires attuning with the genetic mind or collective consciousness of the species through time. We have a more direct contact personally with the that. I can not imagine with multiple universes to explore in an infinity of time and space, that I would come back here, and see if it could have gotten any worse then it was.. We come back here because certain gravitational forces keep us here and each planet is different in its stage of evolution and frequency. We, as spirits, are most in harmony with the frequencies here, and so we return here. The wisdom in this is that it is only going to get better when we make it better. When we realize this as a planetary citizenry we will make it better and there is much gained in that process both spiritually and personally. The future of this planet is pregnant with many terrible dangers and the most magnificent promise of advancement and evolution that we have ever experienced. Or would linger around to pester people as a ghost... The SciFi channel series Ghost Hunter, is imo full of it, because if they would have really found something, then it would have been CNN/ABC/MSNBC material proving the afterlife beyond a doubt. IMO ghosts are echoes and consciousnesses that have not yet been absorbed or integrated into the spirit frequency. Any answers or speculations, or profound statements known that were made by experts on the subject? As to who I am to give my opinions: I have written the papers on WingMakers paintings 1, 6 and 17 and am working on 18 and three books, the first of which to be published will probably be about the future and Nostradamus (yet another one, but very important for humanity). I experienced the transformation or Thunderous Silence of Zen with a permanent change in consciousness as the energy rushed up through the body and poured into the brain on 17 September 2001 shortly after "decoding" Chamber 6 painting. Thanks in Advance. You're very welcome. |
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Ara |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Hi Ara,
[QUOTE]It is highly unlikely, if not impossible, these will be either in the far past or the far future as Source will see its best course as a logical and coherent progression in all aspects of evolution. *** It seems it is assumed that a person experiencing a human lifetime is more spiritually advanced than a person who lived 5000 years ago. I stand by my statement that reincarnation is not 'linear' as we think of time. However, maybe there are different 'courses' for different types of 'evolutions'? Now that's a thought isn't it? It’s not so much the person as the spirit that is more advanced. Each lifetime enriches the spirit and so generally speaking a spirit now will be a bit more evolved than it was 5,000 years ago. Humans are a little more difficult to assess if going way back in time, due to the colonization of earth by advanced races in tens and hundreds of thousands of years ago. Some of those could be said to be more advanced than we humans are and some more barbaric. All the souls will have evolved to some degree, however. Reincarnation is not linear from the Sovereign Integral perspective, but from the individuated spirit and the human housing that spirit it is experienced as linear. Reincarnation actually defies description, because it is only the spirit which reincarnates, but it does not really experience the physical realm; it is the physical human that does. Yet the human does not reincarnate. S/He dies each time never to return; a new personality appears for the spirit to house, and that personality may have some traits of the previous one but the DNA and personality are essentially different, as are the environment, upbringing and experiences shaping the character and person. This means that a spirit does not incarnate in a time or situation vastly different from its own evolutionary level. *** My understanding is that advanced spirits do incarnate into lower evolutionary soul-minds to assist in the evolution of that soul-mind. I was under the impression that what you refer to as the “soul-mind” was the spirit. Spirits incarnate into humans and individuals that are most compatible for it to have the experiences it needs. How the mind of that human will develop – it is rudimentary at birth -- will depend upon a number of factors: physical and DNA and genetic circumstances of the parents, environment, experiences, how the thinking develops, and how the individual responds to the ideas and frequencies of the spirit as it goes through its life. Advanced spirits usually come in to assist the species, or the evolution of the genetic mind rather than one individual. The spirit of you and I will therefore not IMO incarnate next in the past because it has had the experiences it needs from the past and -- most importantly -- the frequencies of the planet in the past are not in harmony with the spirits of today. Simply put, we have evolved beyond the past. Yes. Simply put. ***In this inter dimensional time line reality. It is the only one that really concerns us. We are only ever on our time line reality. The Sovereign Integral perspective is valuable for showing us the cosmological overview, the greater picture and as a sign post and guide to the future that from its perspective we already are, but we cannot literally live life as the Sovereign Integral. One reason the human does not remember all their previous lives is because it would overload the human mind causing it to break down and detract from the work, lessons, and progress at hand. The life of the Sovereign Integral is different from our own. We can invite its qualities into our life and learn much from it on a continual basis, but insisting its perceptions of time and lives be our own would be impractical. We’d never make an appointment to meet anyone or get anything done if we lived the reality that all time is one (which it actually is in the cosmic sense). To over simplify the analogy it would be like a NASA space scientist being made to go and live with a tribe in the jungle, which is not only unnecessary it is wasteful: he can better serve at NASA; and the tribesman can better serve in the jungle. Each has their place, so too, the past and future, otherwise evolution would be a chaotic mess. *** Sometimes the past needs to learn from the future and the future needs to learn from the past. Yes, and this occurs often. But one doesn’t go and volunteer an entire lifetime there. It best happens only when the time is right. Traveling there one could get stuck and remain there, because the spirit is generally held by the planetary frequencies. It would then have to wait for the planet to evolve along the timeline to where you were in the future before incarnating again. It’s all to do with spirit and planetary frequencies. We could travel to the future or past and learn and see both in visions via the genetic mind and learn a great deal, and as we correct the flaws in our genetic makeup that have existed since before we came to this planet this will happen much more in the future aiding us immensely. The biggest advances, of course, will come from the future, rather than the past. We will learn much from the very ancient past too, but not by going there to be born; we would have to wait for millions of years for our next birth if we did that until that time caught up with our own. Maybe that’s nothing in the near eternity of the universe, but I’ll pass on the option. Remember our individuated spirits are not the Sovereign Integral. Each individuated spirit is on its own path of evolution which is basically linear, even though that is not how the Sovereign Integral sees it from its perspective of the spirit having fulfilled its evolutionary purpose to oneness with it and other spirits. The same, according to Meier, goes for the future: The future earth is of a higher frequency, more advanced, and our spirits need to evolve up to that level before they can incarnate there. It would be only a very advanced spirit that could in theory incarnate in our future e.g. a more advanced being in every respect from somewhere else in the cosmos that e.g. came here and accidentally died here; but even that spirit will have to wait for the planet’s frequency to catch up with its own before an incarnation could take place, and as time as such doesn’t matter to Source or the spirit it is a mute point. *** A spirit is clothed in physical DNA, as long as the two are merged in potential there should not be a problem. All the energies which come together to form one's "bodies" come from creation itself. Many of the energies and reality for the physical body come from the parents. If an incoming spirit is more advanced then extra "folds" are placed into that person's Being to accommodate that advanced spirit. This does happen, but it is not a general rule. It is like trying to place a 100 watt light globe into a light socket which can only take 50 watts, the thing blows a fuse, however if you stick the 100 watt globe into a socket which can in potential accommodate an 100 watt globe there is no blow out. As long as the physical and spiritual frequencies merge in potential there is no problem. When I speak of future above I mean far in the future 10-30,000 years. We – our spirits -- are all continuously incarnating into the future to some degree. This is another reason why intergalactic species do not mix en mass with other species lower on the evolutionary scale, like on this planet, on an open and free basis: there is so much at stake if something goes wrong. *** Off World intelligences are very much mixing with the humans on this planet. Not only are they hybridizing their physical DNA with human physical DNA some of those Off World Intelligences are incarnating into the hybrid forms themselves. I would not endorse these as being on a much higher evolutionary level than ourselves -- if that. Some of them are not even human but are androids, and this may well be another reason why androids are chosen for intergalactic work by lesser advanced space traveling species. We – our spirits -- once traveled through space millions of years ago too. It is the advanced ones like the Federation ETs that don’t interact with us much at all – until we evolve more. The only thing lower on the evolutionary scale here is the 'human soul-mind'. It is the parameters of the human soul-mind which are extending (evolving) via merging and interaction with Other Intelligences. The genetic mind of the human species is indeed evolving due to contact with these species. In fact it is for this very reason that the change in our planet's frequency is occurring IMO; because we have some such spirits here waiting, which have enabled the frequency jump to be made earlier than it otherwise would have. *** Yes this I agree with and goes with what I have stated above. According to Meier there were over 100,000 such beings on the spaceship that, after mechanical failure, self-destructed over Tunguska in the early twentieth century. These spirits, along with the natural evolution of the planet, have significantly raised the frequency around this planet IMO. James (of WingMakers, Lyricus, and Event Temples) has also indicated that it is the presence of an influx of souls/spirits from elsewhere in the universe that are essentially responsible for the planetary frequency raising we are about to experience. ***Yes I agree. Elsewhere from 'all' the universe, from all times. These are very difficult subjects for most to grasp, especially so because we have no scientific proof of them as yet. IMO the reason people think such future and past incarnations are possible is because we are moving closer to the Sovereign Integral frequency all the time and identifying with it, and from Its perspective that is how things can appear; but that is because it is beyond this time system and sees and experiences it all as one. We and our individuated spirits are in a different situation -- currently. *** yes hence why I wrote about inter dimensional time lines where the future, as we would consider it, has already happened and reincarnation not being linear as we know time. Yes, that’s the overview, but it is not how we -- our individuated spirits -- experience it. Déjà Vu, IMO only relates to brain activity. It’s a very curious phenomenon, and I once experienced this for an entire afternoon, which was a very uncanny experience, but it relates more to feelings of familiarity and memory in the brain triggering in and causing it. The brain and mind do strange things like this as we know from many reported cases, and especially illnesses (not that déjà vu is an illness) how strange connections in the brain can and do frequently occur. Spirit is immaculately intelligent, because it is guided always by Source, and it never guides itself to experience the same thing twice, just as there are no two spirits identical, no two experiences are identical; if a human lesson needs learning again there will always be subtle differences at least; exactly the same lesson would likely lead to exactly the same result and a broken record syndrome. Everything living is wonderfully unique in its existence. ***This I agree with. Nice discussing with you Ara, Nice to discuss this with you too Chris. It's always nice to read another person's thoughts on the subjects of life. Thank you for taking the time to share with me. And you too. Chris |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Hi, Chris, okay, I will go to the website and read about it, thank you. You gave me some ideas of additional questions to ask during session, things and beings to look for.
So far, we have not seen any truly benevolent beings in the between lives and I think it is a "cr_p shoot" whether we are evolving or devolving. Perhaps we have to devolve before we can evolve. Hubby's between lives experiences that we have seen so far is that he sometimes is guided to a body, or some compulsion causes him to sense out a suitable female to be his mother. So far, everyone in my immediate family, including my hubby, have been with me many lifetimes. It seems to me at this time that we tune into each other's wavelengths and that there is some unfinished business. In my last session I had an interesting experience of cutting off a part of myself that offended me and sending it back to the static sphere. Nice thread. |
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It may be a cr-p shoot if you pick anyone at random to see whether that person is progressing or regressing but if someone is attempting to progress you can be pretty sure they are in some way or another at least as far as they are able, and who can do more than that. It is not that the personality evolves so much as the spirit; the personality lives and dies. It serves spirit and Source in evolution or it does not. The spirit evolves via the personalities that it houses throughout its evolution. The personality has only one short lifespan in which to evolve; spirit has a near eternity. I've had to revise my ideas of families coming together again in other lives -- a popular interpretation made more so by writers like Shirley Maclaine, whose books I nonetheless enjoyed. It is not so much the physical personalities as these are so dependent on the parental DNA and genes, as it is a spiritual family, the spirit personalities of which are forever evolving and growing, and IMO are merely rudimentary at present. These spirit "identities" or "individuals" may come together but the personalities they express through will depend upon: inherited traits from the new physical DNA and genetics; environment and upbringing, including experiences; and influences spirit may have on these, which will depend upon how receptive the personality is to the promptings, ideas, inspirations, frequencies, and "nudging" of spirit. There are beings on other levels, but between lives there are no people, which may be why you "have not seen any truly benevolent beings in the between lives". The earth personalities die at death. The consciousness remains for a while as it is absorbed and integrated into spirit, but it would IMO be in error to refer to this as a personality. I know Sylvia Browne and a myriad of others would disagree, and I used to share their views, but I must be true to the reality I experienced. Death is different, and when you think about it it is also logically so. Why would a personality survive death only to disappear upon reincarnation? We know the new life is inherited from the new parents and their DNA and genetics. Science quite categorically has proven it so. Even the Buddha said each personality is quite different in the next incarnation. This always left me wondering, "What is it then that reincarnates?" And it is: the spirit, individuated spirit. It is very natural for human beings to think of life after death as a continuation of themselves in some form, but every person will surely die and end, and the spirit will house a completely different personality next time. The closest we can come to reincarnating again is to ally ourselves with our individuated spirit as far as possible and in that reincarnate; but the human being always tends to imagine this as more like herself/himself than spirit because we are so removed from spirit which is essentially an indescribable integrated frequency of love, knowledge, intelligence, wisdom, goodness etc which is reflected in humanity. My spirit, for example, upon my death will integrate all my experiences into its frequency: all the experiences, all the knowledge, all the thoughts, actions and interests will all be noted and integrated, though it will only "take" that which furthers its evolution. All else is so much fluff that is just left (what I had for breakfast six weeks ago, unless that was somehow very significant, which I don't recall it was). This will all be added to its storehouse from all its previous incarnations that are already thoroughly integrated into an inviolable whole. When this process of my integration into my individuated spirit is complete the spirit's next incarnation can begin. "I" in as much as "I" exist -- and it will not be as a personality -- will just be another integrated component of the individuated spirit as it progresses along its evolutionary path. In a future incarnation spirit may provide the usage of any of its aspects from its last life (mine) or any aspect or aspects of any life before that for the new personality in order for spirit to further develop; it is, however, more likely to do this in a completely integrated fashion, rather than in terms of specific lifetimes. It has, after all, been thoroughly integrated into a coherent whole, assuming it had the necessary time to assimilate everything, which is rarely the case with our intensely overpopulated world continually calling on spirits to incarnate into new life forms ASAP. Quote:
If I have time I will post a thread on WingMakers Transformation. Very nice talking with you Gnosis5. Chris |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Thank you all for your help on this. I have much to learn...and appearantly no linear time to do it in. For anyone interested in learning more about this, like me, is there a source with which further study can be accomplished? Any links are greatly appreciated!
Peace |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Hi wilsonericq7 and all,
You might find interest in a book titled "Life before Life" by Helen Wambach. As a clinical psychologist in the 1970s she regressed hundreds of people, sometimes in large groups, to probe the soul memory of life before this life..... before entering the womb again to embark on the current earth sojourn. From the report of most participants in her studies, the process of re-incarnation is evidently highly organised beyond the earth plane. Wise guides assist souls to identify and surrender to the (karmic) necessity of meeting past relationships in the proposed new incarnation. Karmic ties determine a soul's magnetic attraction to a particular family. This can include love or revulsion which is predicated on past experiences together. Various themes were gleaned from the regression experience. Participants in the study reported that their new parents and siblings once played different familial roles in previous lives. ie, the proposed mother was once a sister or wife. The brother was once the father or husband or friend or enemy....etc. Souls seem to re-incarnate in groups until they can learn tolerance and love for each other. Some couldn't wait to join loved ones while others were filled with trepidation at the prospect of a new incarnation in the proposed family. It seems we all surrender to the necessity of a responsibility and work that must be accomplished. And of course this includes all the other souls we will interact with in a more than casual way. For some souls, strong negative emotions (the scars of the past) bring them together repeatedly throughout the ages. For others it is a mutual friendship built on common cause. ie, two people perhaps in the same field of service drawn together over and again. Most families are a mixture of both of these kinds of relationships and so are friendships. Dr Wabach's studies resonated with me long before i had similar memories to those reported by her subjects. My mum has been my mother several times and so has my father. My son was once a friend. These are the nuts and bolts of our sojourn through the earth plane. The law is the law and each soul must fulfill it by being willing to meet the effects of our own actions. Cause and effect is the law of karma and we usually reap a mixture of sweet and bitter fruit. Don't we know it. However, we can meet our karma and karmic relationships under the guidance and inspiration of the inner-Christ. That is how we fulfill all things and transcend the rounds of karma and re-incarnation... "nevermore to go out or in". |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Hi wilsonericq7 & all
Very interesting thread with tremendous amounts of thoughtful posts. wilsonericq7, along the same lines as the book mentioned by milk and honey, you might look into Michael Newton's "Journey of Souls" and "Destiny of Souls". Both books are filled with past-life regression accounts, with detailed analysis too. I've re-read them both several times, and each time I gain some new insight. Also, I've had several past-life regression/life-between-life sessions from a hypnotherapist trained by MN. I highly recommend it - my view of all things pertaining to life here on earth and in the spirit realms has been validated and expanded...:original: Alloura |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
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*A moon based container that traps the souls who decide to joint the light at the end of the tunnel shortly after the separation from the body. Thanks. -feeler |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
H. Charles Berner's "Manual for guiding a person through the after death experience"- http://www.charlesberner.org/Tibet_Book_Dead_web.pdf, although somewhat poetic, gives quite a good account of the sequence of the "after death experience". During regressions people go through the upsets (of separations), problems, done/not done, then dichotomies of good/bad, love/hate, ..., you name it, of the life they leave behind, and the energy fields (colors, sounds, emotions, ...) manifest as the person releases from them and from that maze called the mind which contains identities, guides, entities, etc, some hostile, some helpfull. It's very interesting actually.
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Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Wow, lots of info to digest. I can't understand why WE can't remember our past experiences / lifetimes here on this planet, without regression techniques? I'm not trying to make things 'easier' for us to learn or correct any bad we had done in past lifetimes; but thru my researching it seems as tho other being shed their 'containers' and can remember themselves--they just start in a new 'container'. What is so different about us especially if we are reincarnating many times???
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As soon as one finds the basis for their attraction they can no longer be trapped. Past life sessions help one to examine these incidents and change their mind about it and drop the compulsion to go and check out the pretty lights. :lol3: |
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Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Hi, Chris, would you detail your transformation experience? Thank you.
Gnosis5 |
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Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
Many replies, which did not have time to read, so I will simply answer from my own experience:
There is no set limit in years between each incarnation, even the idea is absurd as time do not exist on the spiritual planes, and a person can basically be reborn as soon as he dies. However normally a person do not get reincarnated that soon but spend some time in the lower astral planes for a while, some ascend further up, and some are never reincarnated. Some only reincarnate a part of themselves, a soul fragment. For further information on the last part, please check my thread at http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/s...ead.php?t=6337 where I explain this concept in depth and I think you may find it quite interesting in regards of your research. I also explain there how several people claiming to be the reincarnation of the same past person can in fact all be correct about it. Peace profound, -EA |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
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Why stick around? My same gripe with "ghosts". Further more, if this universe is waiting a cold dark death, in a couple of gazillions ofbillions of years, when the suns have burned out, where will the reincarnations continue? |
Re: Reincarnation/Timeline Question
In almost all cases people do not "chose" to be reincarnated, they are so because they are trapped here. The major point of spiritual development is to understand this and be able to be free and ascend to higher realms of existence. But the majority of people are clueless when it comes to their own being and they are constantly filled with lies and deceit by the religious institutions and so on.
I will now move on to talk about Ghosts, as they relate to why people are stuck here just like the Ghosts themselves are. In this case, I assume you are talking about Ghosts as the Spirit of passed people. These people, or Ghosts, exist on a lower level of the astral realm very close to this physical one and they are for the most part trapped there due to various reasons. Some of the reasons are that they are not aware of being dead, or they do not know where to go, they are lost and have no one to help them getting further, or they are trying desperately to contact their family and loved ones and so on and thus keep stuck here on the lower plane. In some instances a Ghost can manifest and be physically visible, this is done through harnessing the energies in the environment around it when it find itself here in the physical plane as an energy form. It can gather the molecules around it energetically so that they are structured around the shape of the Ghost and thus become more dense and visible by light. Some emit energy in the form of light and thus become visible, but the same principle applies of structuring molecules around its energy core which this light is emitted through. An interesting thing about Ghosts is that they can exist and manifest even after their soul have gone further, or been reincarnated. This is due to the different layers of our beings, and sometimes an outer shell of energy is left which functions as a sort of imprint in its environment after its "occupant" has left. Thus you have the "repeater ghosts" which simply appear and do the same action over every time they are observed, almost mechanically. This is the energetic shell left over of the original "person" after he passed further from the lower plane, and this shell has its own limited sort of consciousness directly connected to its original "occupant". This makes it appear and act as the original person, and sometimes enough consciousness is left over to even communicate some with such an entity, and this often leads to people thinking they are in contact with their dead family members and so on, while in reality the "true" person has already left and gone elsewhere to other realms of existence, and they are merely in contact with a "shadow copy" of the true person. Eventually this shell, or shadow copy, whatever you want to call it, will wear out its energy and dissolve into the Spirit, or the Ether as it has been called, which is the energy field the realm it exists withing consists of. In some cases, these "shells" can be entered by other entities, and thus they can keep it "alive" for a longer period of time and also pretend to be the original person and trick people that get in contact with it. This would in a sense be similar to how a physical body can be possessed by a spirit entity, except you have a spirit body - the shell - being possessed by another spirit entity. While all this happens, the Original Person, would find himself in one of several scenarios: Either he has been reincarnated and entered a new physical body, he is traveling around in the lower astral realms with his astral body, or he has ascended to higher astral realms and continue his existence and new experiences there gaining new insights and pursuing his new Life as an ascended being. Most people, due to their lack of spiritual knowledge and understanding, find themselves in the lower astral planes after death in a form where they are what we can call "lost ghosts" as explained above. And this is the important part - our lives here are really a preparation for death, and we should do our best to gain as much understanding about the after life we can before we enter it so we will know what to expect and what to do once there. Most religions are completely off here and are responsible of many problems for people passing over - buddhism is a good exception with guidance for the afterlife being given to the dead person. Love and blessings, Edward Alexander |
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