understanding death
 

http://www.yogananda-srf.org/images/insight/death.gif


Every one of us is going to die someday, so there is no use in being afraid of death. You don't feel miserable at the prospect of losing consciousness of your body in sleep; you accept sleep as a state of freedom to look forward to. So is death; it is a state of rest, a pension from this life. There is nothing to fear. When death comes, laugh at it. Death is only an experience through which you are meant to learn a great lesson: you cannot die.

http://www.yogananda-srf.org/images/dingbat/minion.gif

Though the ordinary man looks upon death with dread and sadness, those who have gone before know it as a wondrous experience of peace and freedom.

http://www.yogananda-srf.org/images/dingbat/minion.gif

At death, you forget all the limitations of the physical body and realize how free you are. For the first few seconds there is a sense of fear -- fear of the unknown, of something unfamiliar to the consciousness. But after that comes a great realization: the soul feels a joyous sense of relief and freedom. You know that you exist apart from the mortal body.

http://www.yogananda-srf.org/images/dingbat/minion.gif

The consciousness of the dying man finds itself suddenly relieved of the weight of the body, of the necessity to breathe, and of any physical pain. A sense of soaring through a tunnel of very peaceful, hazy, dim light is experienced by the soul. Then the soul drifts into a state of oblivious sleep, a million times deeper and more enjoyable than the deepest sleep experienced in the physical body.... The after-death state is variously experienced by different people in accordance with their modes of living while on earth. Just as different people vary in the duration and depth of their sleep, so do they vary in their experiences after death.

http://www.yogananda-srf.org/images/dingbat/minion.gif

Our real self, the soul, is immortal. We may sleep for a little while in that change called death, but we can never be destroyed. We exist, and that existence is eternal. The wave comes to the shore, and then goes back to the sea; it is not lost. It becomes one with the ocean, or returns again in the form of another wave. This body has come, and it will vanish; but the soul essence within it will never cease to exist. Nothing can terminate that eternal consciousness.

http://www.yogananda-srf.org/images/dingbat/minion.gif


The selections featured here are excerpted from Paramahansa Yogananda's book, WHERE THERE IS LIGHT: Insight & Inspiration for Meeting Life's Challenges.

I am posting this thread because I feel that as much as we have to understand our relation to life it is as important to understand our relation to death for this is part of our existence .We should not wait for death to come to transcend it and come to the plain realization that we are immortal.

Kindness
mudra

Re: understanding death
 

Thx Mudra
I don't fear the reaper :death1: :original:

Re: understanding death
 

Me neither, but when I do go I'd like to go in my sleep like my Grandad, not screaming in panic like his passengers.

A..

... ok ok, I know its an old one.

Re: understanding death
 

I'm 50/50 on death. I'd prefer it to come when my loved ones are well-off and will not suffer through such a loss.

Re: understanding death
 

I dont fear death. However I have to agree with Humble, where family is concerned.

Re: understanding death
 

How will being well-off help them deal with your death??? :confused:

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Thanks mudra, no fear here either! If I have any relatives left when I die, I will make sure they know how I feel about death and to throw a big party!

Re: understanding death
 

It is my belief that you will not die unless your soul agrees to it. So yes, that means everyone on that plane agreed...ah, but there were those who were supposed to be on that plane but somehow missed it. No coincidence there, they were not ready.

My father, when he was 32, almost died from a penicillin allergy. He was given the choice of whether to stay or go--my brother and I were very young. He said no, I want to stay here and watch my children grow up. Now he is 84. I asked him if he regretted that choice...of course he said no, but I'm sure he had his days!

Re: understanding death
 

I have hesitated to comment on this thread, but I have decided to anyway! The only Death that humans should accept is death of their ego self which is not physical death. Physical death to me is failure to graduate from this earth school! The wheel of reincarnation is real alright, but its a limitation. We do have examples of people ascending with there bodies and to me its a much more acceptable science.

Death is a bit like time or calendars. Its an agreement, a belief, and we don't have to follow everyone else like lemmings over the cliff!!!

To die and have to come back through birth and learning everything all over again is sad. We are just repeating what we could have learned in our lifetime. And its not about fearing death. Its about asking the question "Is there more to life than what I have been taught" Is this it? Born, grow, die!!! Over and over again. There is more and I know there is more.

Love and Light

Carmen

Re: understanding death
 

If you fix yourself to a form be it a short lasting one or an everlasting one will that make any difference ?

Having access to that formless realm is truly liberating. It frees you from bondage to form and identification with form. It is life in its undifferentiated state prior to its fragmentation into multiplicity. We may call it the Unmanifested, the invisible Source of all things, the Being within all beings. It is a realm of deep stillness and peace, but also of joy and intense aliveness. Whenever you are present, you become "transparent" to some extent to the light, the pure consciousness that emanates from this Source. You also realize that the light is not separate from who you are but constitutes your very essence.

Echkart Tolle

Kindness
mudra

Re: understanding death
 

Dear Mudra, to me its not about fixing to a form. The ego is fixed to a form, the Great Self comes and goes at will. It can manifest the body, then increase its frequency and disappear from this realm. The body is the garment that we wear to express on this plane of demonstration. Trouble is the ego self has taken over and our spiritual selves have been buried by limiting beliefs and attitudes. We are then body/mind. The Great Self, the spiritual Self, is mind/body. The body is then subject to the mind and is multi-dimensional.

Love to you

Carmen

Re: understanding death
 

Wow Carmen ,, you been doing your homework again :wink2:

Re: understanding death
 

Hello dear Carmen and thank for your postings.

I believe you and I agree:

It's not that we have a life. We are the life.The One Life, the one consciousness that pervades the entire universe and takes temporary form to experience itself as a stone or blade of grass, as an animal, a person, a star or a galaxy.

Kindness and love
mudra

Re: understanding death
 

Death where are your thorns?
Death where is your sting?

Im not my body not my mind not my soul not even me

What others think you are - You are not
What you think you are - You are not

I Am nothing like a person no not even close

Re: understanding death
 

Die to the little self

while still in the body ..

die to ignorance

greed

suffering

fear

control

and then realy live ...

and then realy die ...

finaly ....

put an end to it ...

off the wheel

the merry go round ...

Re: understanding death
 

Interesting post Mudra, although I may digress from the subject of death
I still think it is worth saying.

If we are eternal and I believe we are, then we have existed in one form or another for billions of years and will continue to exist for billions more. So then what is the purpose of this Earth plain existence in a physical 3D body?
As we evolve I believe we eventually become what I term an enlightened being. To be enlightened it implys that we can answer any question and to do that we must have experienced the situation of the question, honey is just honey until you taste it. Therefore to experience by touch taste smell sound and sight emotions and feelings is truly wonderful. To hold a new born baby in your arms, to experience the excitement of youth the wisdom of age the transcendence of death. Only one life time would be way to short to gain the infinite experiences on offer. To be a Fly for a day or a mighty Oak tree for four hundred years.
So to me the only thing of substance is experience.

Now to the nature of experience. it is my understanding that initially we were beings of positive free will DNA (consciousness) and gave unconditionally as the apple gives up it's fruit so it's seed can be carried all was in balance, until greed and avarice evolved. Through time these traits have been deliberately infesting our DNA and in certain percentage has become dominant manifesting as ultra egos with no or very little compassion or care.

Again it is my believe that the majority of humanity still has enough positive DNA and if nurtured and practiced can return to dominance. The challenge as I see it is to do what my conscious suggests despite what my Ego wants and to give freely without conditions.

Although the presence of the negative energies of ego in us all may seem to be repressive, we here in this existence are unique in the fact that we have adapted to dealing with it. I pray and hope that humanity can wake up to this fact and begin to restore the balance. :original:

Re: understanding death
 

The best way to get over a fear of death is to astral project. Once you have been out of your body, the thought of it all ending vanishes forever.

Re: understanding death
 

Boy do I struggle doing that, tried lots of times:wall: fall asleep every time . No fear of death though saw lots of it and spirit in a job I had. Even made contact with a couple of them:thumb_yello:

Re: understanding death
 

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On Death and Dying

Die Art zu Leben

The Nature of Life (or) The Manner of Living (or) How to Live

"The fearlessness must be formed in such a way that it is never foolhardy, rather simply in such a way that the grief, the hindrances and the difficulties, and so forth, are not avoided, so that from them it can be learnt - and also the cognition matures - that all life of any kind is bound together and requires the other and indeed extending beyond death.

"If this cognition matures then intensive contemplation is engaged about the significance of death and dying which exhibits so many facets of the perishable.

"This cognition in turn enables the human to draw full use from his life, as long as time allows this.

"The use is the creation of further cognition, of knowledge, love, peace, wisdom and harmony and security, to be able to die without feeling regret, without having to reproach oneself for living life wrongly and having senselessly wasted it.

"Therefore there is only the way of true evolution which says that life must be lived all the time and in every situation so correctly that neither in life nor in death does it evoke regret."

--- From: ---

http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/mei...l152.sww69.htm

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The act of dying is well known to all of us, though many refuse to face this in a realistic way. Reincarnation IS the true Reality. All that we learn in this life is stored in the Comprehensive Consciousness Block between the lives, and is accessible to our Spirit as we generate a new personality in the next incarnation. Nothing gained is ever lost.

Then the meaning and purpose of THIS life is to learn what we may for the continued Evolution of our Spirits. When we find solutions to the problems of life, the lessons of living, these lessons do not need to be repeated again - we move on to new problems and new lessons. This is the path of Evolution - to evolve to greater and greater challenges for our continued growth in Spiritual Wisdom.

The Ultimate Goal of all our lives => some 60- to 80-Billion years experienced in the Material worlds => is to re-unite again with Creation, from which our Spirits originate, along with all other Spirits which have been on all the different paths of their own Evolution. The ReUnion of Spirits come from everywhere in the Entire Universe. The Purpose for this is to bring the GIFT of our accumulated Knowledge, Love and Wisdom back to Creation.

http://www.theyfly.com/

http://futureofmankind.co.uk/

http://us.figu.org/portal/Default.aspx

http://forum.figu.org/cgi-bin/us/discus.cgi

Peace

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Re: understanding death
 

Death is a stripping away of all that is not you. The secret of life is to "die before you die" --- and find that there is no death.

Eckhart Tolle - Stillness speaks

Re: understanding death
 

Reincarnation doesn't help you if in your next incarnation you still don't know who you are.

Eckhart Tolle

Re: understanding death
 

"Therefore there is only the way of true evolution which says that life must be lived all the time and in every situation so correctly that neither in life nor in death does it evoke regret."



I like this idea Jrod .. so true

Thank you

Loving kindness
mudra

Re: understanding death
 

Physical death to me is failure to graduate from this earth school! The wheel of reincarnation is real alright, but its a limitation.

Some of the holiest men on this earth have reincarnated over and over again and ego had nothing to do with it The Dali Lama is one example our earth has been in lock down till we learn the lessons we need to in order to go next level. But for some reason this time is going to be different . There will be a graduation this time

Re: understanding death
 

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Mudra, Thank you for opening this Thread. It is long overdue that Human Beings should realistically examine the ART of living and dying.

This, in your opening statement, is a "wake-up call" for those still sleeping with their illusions...:

"I am posting this thread because I feel that as much as we have to understand our relation to life it is as important to understand our relation to death for this is part of our existence. We should not wait for death to come to transcend it and come to the plain realization that we are immortal."


http://www.abstractdigitalartgallery..._Lightning.jpg


Love and Blessings

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. . Could the "tunnel" look like this?...
. . http://www.abstractdigitalartgallery...al-Psytrip.jpg

Colors would be reversed, the center will be full of Bright, White Light


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Re: understanding death
 

I wrote to the dalai lama a few years ago and he specified in his answer that this is his last incarnation on earth. I believe masters and wise men incarnated on this earth voluntarily with a purpose in mind and a goal to reach.And so is the case of many lightworkers that are around today.

Loving kindness
mudra

Re: understanding death
 

We will see when the time comes Jrod. I believe as Consciousness evolves and moves to a higher gear this time going through a tunnel won't be needed .As far as I can sense it these tunnels were part of the process of reincarnation . Graduating through the heart will leave no room for guilt feelings that one needs to make up for . This is how we will reach a new plane of existence.

Loving kindness
mudra

Re: understanding death
 

Dolores Cannon does a GREAT job of explaining death in 'Moving into a New Earth'... I can't find the link but it was an amazing description, one I resonate with greatly. I highly recommend it if you can find it :thumb_yello:

Re: understanding death
 

Not the tunnel I saw.:original: Beautiful image though.

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I like the fact that when I look at this particular picture, it moves for me. No I am not on drugs.

I see a wormhole instead of a tunnel..if that makes any sense...:lol3:


Winter Wolf

Re: understanding death
 

You only need to die to the ego to gain eternal LIFE! There is no second death for those who choose life. To die before we die is to live eternally forevermore :) and gain our true spiritual identity in the mind of God. We are infinite spiritual beings who live in the eternal Now, if only we would remember...

Mudra, I agree with you. It is time for a great harvest and many beings, millions embodied now will achieve full spiritual freedom within this lifetime.

I believe one of the major illusions we must break through is believing that only famous people who are outwardly very spiritual can change the world and achieve full enlightenment.

The Dalai Lama is a being with great momentums, however, there are many many beings with increible spiritual momentum's embodied around the world in very normal lives, and it is simply up to us to remember and take back our power. We live in a celebrity culture and it is time the people realized the power lies within them, not the famous person outside of them...

:original:

Re: understanding death
 

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For the further evolution in our understanding of dying, I share this quote from my friend Jacob (aka: Phaethonsfire), who is a moderator at the FIGU Forums:


Life, Death, Rebirth and Love

In human life there are two things at the very least certain: The fact that you are alive, and the fact that it will end, those things are for the 'average everyday Earth-human' two of the very few certainty he has in his life, usually he is not aware that Creation is everywhere around him and in him as the tiny Spirit part that lives in him and even makes his existence possible in the material realm.

People have often a deep fear of death, and although death is inevitable, people ignore it because it frightens them, death is for many people still the end, after which they fall apart in oblivion according to their beliefs.

People have deep rooted fears about their loved ones, about losing their loved ones when they die, or vice versa when they die themselves.

True love, the one love that really connects people never dies, not even in death, it's the kind of love that will overcome the barriers of life and death altogether, it overcomes the barriers of time and space. Once a true love is existent between two people, nothing can destroy that.

If you have someone in your life, that you really love, like the Law of Love describes, and you feel the unity between you and that person, that feeling that is always there even when physically separated, by distance or in death, then you should know that the Love bond you have with the other is unbreakable.

Love comes in many forms, yet all love forms are based on the same Law.

It's the Law that Love is the bond of all life, and all existing things in the Universe and above, and that everything is a part of everything, indivisible, eternal and everlasting.

So, when you love your husband, wife, brother or sister, and death comes calling for one of them, then know that when there is love in you for your loved one, that they will always be a part of you, and know that in the next life, although not consciously, you will meet them again as friend, wife, husband, brother or sister, you will instantaneously feel a deep connection a bond that feels very good, yet very well known...like you know the other for years.

Love is the bond that keeps everything together, and a bond forged in love is unbreakable, in life, death and rebirth.

Go to: ...
http://forum.figu.org/us/messages/13...html#POST12124

Then scroll down to Jacob / Phaethonsfire post number 158 on this page.

In Peace ... The Light of Truth goes forth

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Re: understanding death
 

The late Mr. X...the archivist...described aliens as not forgetting their previous lives when their bodies die. They just change clothes...so to speak. Why can't we do that? Have the aliens messed with us so we don't remember? Is this a control mechanism? Have they shortened our lives also? Look at the book of Genesis. There is a lot that I don't believe in Genesis...but what about people living to be nearly 1,000 years old?

I currently think we simply get recycled. I'm not expecting heaven, hell, purgatory, ascension, descension, or some beautiful mystical experience...just a painful review of my pathetic life...with some stern words from a panel of humans, reptilians, and greys...with perhaps some discussion over where to reincarnate me...and then back into the 'Disneyland of the Gods' for more fun! I'd prefer an E Ticket over an SOL Ticket next time...thank-you. As usual...this is simply educated and thoughtful speculation...and could be pure bs.

Incidently...if death is such a wonderful thing...why don't we all commit suicide? My answer is...that despite all of the sickness, misery, pain, and suffering of all kinds...this physical life is where the action is. Hopefully...over the next few hundred years...we can refine out a lot of the horrible suffering which so many people currently endure. In 'Hotel California' there are the haunting lyrics...'You can check-out...but you can never leave.'

Just as I hit 'save' for the above 3 paragraphs...someone knocked on my door saying that a boy just had a terrible accident on his skateboard...and that I needed to call 911...which I immediately did. He was laying face down in the street...with blood running from his head. He was conscious...but barely. His face was badly injured...and I think he almost died...75 feet from where I was typing a message about death. I hope he'll be OK. I've bypassed this thread for several days. Why did I choose to read it and comment on it when I did? Coincidence? Probably...but it's still creepy.

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To further our understanding in respect to reincarnation: ...

IV. Did the Source of the Gospels Contain Teachings on Reincarnation?

Some who have examined the apparent reality of reincarnation have looked into the Gospels for clues that Jesus actually taught the subject, and have found them. As to how such clues originated, it is usually postulated that following the 2nd Council of Constantinople in 553 C.E. the Gospels were edited so as to remove all obvious traces of teachings and implications of reincarnation.

However, there is sufficient evidence from early church fathers to indicate that some of the verses to be discussed, and which exist in about the same form today, greatly predate this council. Hence a much more likely possibility is that the New Testament gospels themselves derive mainly from one source, and this source is what had contained Jesus' teachings on reincarnation and karma that were edited out upon first formation of the Gospels in the early second century. ...

Gospel Evidence that Jesus Taught Reincarnation

It is important to examine some particular examples of these Gospel clues, since they are largely unknown within modern scholasticism. Perhaps the primary verse to this effect is Mt 11:14, "...and if you are willing to accept it, he [John the Baptist] is Elijah who is to come."

The only alternative here to the implication that Jesus was talking of Elijah having been a past life of John, who would be reborn again some time in the future, comes from 2 Kgs 2:11 in which Elijah is "taken up by a whirlwind into heaven" and is seen no more.

If it is assumed that this means Elijah never died but was "translated" alive into heaven, the further assumptions are then needed that he later "translated" into the body of John the Baptist and would "translate" into some other body in the future. However, this concept of translation, involving a fully human body that never ages or dies, seems unintelligible in comparison with the reincarnation hypothesis, especially since John is described in Luke's first chapter as having been raised from a baby and never having suddenly changed into Elijah's very own "translated" body.

The reincarnation hypothesis here is consistent with Jesus' wording, "if you are willing to accept it." Probably only a minority of his listeners in Israel believed in reincarnation, with many, especially Pharisees and Sadducees, being opposed to the concept.

Thus, Jesus at that point was speaking just to those who could accept the possibility. It is likely that the Logia had more to say here about Elijah's (John's) future reincarnation that was omitted when Matthew was formed. That Matthew's compiler left this strong a clue behind here is probably attributable to his fondness for Elijah, along with other Old Testament personages, causing him to include as much of this Logia verse as seemed feasible.

Also, this compiler evidently believed in "translation," and supported this belief with his Transfiguration story. Thus he probably would not have felt that he was leaving behind a clue here that his source text had discussed reincarnation.

Another strong clue is found in Mt 16:13-15, "Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, `Who do men say that the Son of man is?' And they said, `Some say John the Baptist, others say Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.' He said to them, `But who do you say that I am?'"

Although it is quite possible that in asking the question Jesus was wondering if the people thought of him as a Messiah of some sort, their response (especially "Jeremiah or one of the prophets") indicates they had a past life in mind. That this did not cause any stir or consternation is consistent with Jesus having wondered what important past life they believed him to have had.

Another clue is Mt 24:4 where we read: "For many will come in my name, saying `I am the Christ!' and they will lead many astray." This makes most sense if Jesus was referring to persons in the distant future who would claim they are reincarnations of him. It makes less sense to think they would claim to be resurrections of him, which would require their asserting to have first appeared on earth in their own time in the full-grown resurrected body of Jesus, never having passed through childhood. Moreover, at the time the text of the verse was spoken, resurrection or "anastasis" referred only to a general resurrection at the end times, and not to the raising up of a particular individual.

Further clues consist of the "incarnation" verses: "I have come not to... but to..." Of these, Mt 5:17 and 10:34 seem here most likely to be in a form close to that of their source. If Jesus had early in life gained an understanding of what his life's mission and goals were to be -- and the "lost years" evidence supports that likelihood, he could then speak as "having come" for such-and-such a purpose. Thus the "incarnation verses" easily fit into the context of Jesus having taught that he, as well as all others, were subject to reincarnation. This provides a real alternative to the interpretation that he was incarnated once and for all as part of a Trinity.

The foregoing clues are mostly absent from the other gospels, indicative of "improvements" directed towards increased orthodoxy as is usually to be expected within later works, and supporting Matthean priority.

If the Logia were the source of Matthew, we then infer that other teachings of reincarnation were omitted from Matthew or were highly edited, with "resurrection" substituted for "reincarnation" or "rebirth."

A verse from John (Jn 9:1-2) regarding the man blind from birth is also commonly cited as indication that Jesus and his disciples assumed reincarnation to be a fact. Although this instance may be an indication that the writer of John had been accustomed to interpreting fate in a karmic sense, the testimony of Papias suggests that only the compiler of Matthew was close enough to the Logia to have left bonafide clues behind from the source document. However, the writers of Luke and John may have been those referred to by the portion of Papias's statement reading "and each interpreted them [the Logia] as best he could."

Text and explanation from Talmud Jmmanuel research, found here: ...

http://www.tjresearch.info/ecumensm.htm#xxx

Truth must come before Peace

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Re: understanding death
 

Thank-you for the great post J rod7. I'll have to read it several times. It contains a lot of good, concise information.

I try to follow the words of Christ...but I currently believe in reincarnation. In principle and concept, at least...they harmonize. I hope the following sermonette is not too theological or preachy. It's a bit of an off-topic non-sequiter...but illustrates three theological perspectives. I identify with the last one...and this view is relatively easily harmonized with the concept of reincarnation. I don't follow eastern mystics...or chant, etc. I just think we should be ethical...and that we get recycled. When we are ethical...we create a better world to get reincarnated back into. It's all about quality of eternal life...and not whether I am going to be 'saved' or not. I think we all get recycled...whether we are good or bad...but we should still be good!

I wrote the following some time ago...and I have recently decided that the concept of God is problematic to the max. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. I tend to think that this applies to all beings in the universe. Conceptualized ideals are helpful...and there is a certain divinity which resides within humanity...and probably within reptilians and greys as well. I really don't know. So interpret my references to God in whatever manner which resonates with your views.

A debate that has raged for centuries is between those who say Jesus was just like us, and those who say He had an advantage over us. Both views state that Jesus perfectly obeyed the law of God from birth to death, and thus secured our salvation, by doing that which we could not do, and that by believing in Christ and His sacrifice, we are accepted by God, and saved for all eternity.

If Jesus was just like us, some believe that the substitutionary atonement is just the beginning, and that we can overcome sin just as Christ overcame sin, and indeed we must do this at the end of time, just before the return of Christ, in order to be saved. That we must stand before God without a mediator. They believe that if Jesus had an advantage over us, that the substitutionary atonement would not be valid. That it would be a hollow victory! They also believe that there is no excuse for sin, and that if there is, then the Devil is right and God is wrong!

Those who believe that Christ had an advantage over us state that Christ is the second Adam, and that He succeeded where Adam failed, and thus secured our salvation. And that there was no taint of sin whatsoever in Christ, both physically and spiritually. Further, that we, with our fallen sinful natures, can never, ever, live sinless lives until Christ returns and gives us new bodies and minds. That it is only by laying hold of the merits of the crucified Christ that we are accepted by God as though we had never sinned, and saved for all eternity.

The first option tends to lead toward legalistic perfectionism. The second option tends to lead toward irresponsibility. What fun!

I'm going to go way, way out on a limb, and say that these two views are delusion vs delusion! They both turn the old, old story of Jesus and His love into a fairy tale. They imply that God is a legalistic, perfectionistic, blood-thirsty monster who doesn't think we're good enough for Him. They are both sort of logical, when isolated from the realities of every day life, but they are utterly illogical when reality is clearly faced without distortion or rationalization.

I believe that Jesus was just like us, but that He was very, very spritually refined and developed, and that He demonstrated to the human race, the true character of God, and what we humans are capable of achieving, and indeed must achieve, to usher in the last great, true renaissance which will bring peace to the world! By His sacrifice on the cross, Jesus made the bloody Old Testament sacrificial system obsolete, and made a new and living way to be right with God available to all, by following His example of loving neighbor as self in a non legalistic-pefectionistic way. To be right with God, we need to be right with God! Not just declared right with God! This symbolic and representational demonstration did not require perfection. Nothing changed between God and us.

We must be in harmony with the character of Christ, and decidedly part of the solution! We must not be in rebellion with the character of Christ, and decidedly part of the problem! We need to be very good, but not perfect! This is an ongoing process of cooperation between the human and the divine.

Re: understanding death
 

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Hello Orthodoxymoron,

You have made some important insight in your words: ...

"Jesus made the bloody Old Testament sacrificial system obsolete, and made a new and living way to be right with God available to all, by following His example of loving neighbor as self in a non legalistic-pefectionistic way. To be right with God, we need to be right with God! Not just declared right with God! This symbolic and representational demonstration did not require perfection. Nothing changed between God and us.

"We must be in harmony with the character of Christ, and decidedly part of the solution! We must not be in rebellion with the character of Christ, and decidedly part of the problem! We need to be very good, but not perfect! This is an ongoing process of cooperation between the human and the divine."

This aligns with the Knowledge that we are all responsible for ourselves in every respect. We then have the obligation to gain further knowledge of the Laws of Creation for our Spiritual Growth. The Laws of Creation both Supersede AND include all the currently known Laws of the Universe, including the Laws of Nature, and all the laws of Science as 'subsets.'

So-called 'sin' is within the Laws which state = there must be polarity in all things, opposites in all things, and the necessity of Cause and Effect at work in all things. The conditions of living set up opportunities to make errors in our actions and in our thoughts. Growth comes when we recognize our errors and correct them, which learning process is at the heart of Spiritual Evolution.

Certainly, NO ONE is able to learn all the necessary lessons to obtain to perfection in one lifetime. Reincarnation IS the true reality, by which through literally millions of lifetimes, we are presented ever greater opportunities, ever greater challenges along each our individual paths. No one is ever given a problem or challenge beyond the individuals' current strength or ability to solve. By solving each in turn, we gain greater strength of Spirit for the next opportunity that comes to each of us.

In Peace

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Re: understanding death
 

Re: understanding death
 

Re: understanding death
 

Thank you all for this forum:original:
When my father died I realized how much I loved him.
I believe that is one more reason why we have death, to realize how much we love the one we lose.

Love Greenlander:wink2:

Re: understanding death
 

*celine hugs you *