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Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend?
Great thread, Chris (greybeard)! So much wisdom here, I really enjoyed reading all comments!
Allow me to share something with you all, Beautiful Souls! It is about a Moment called: “A Story of Great Dissipation “ I stood in front of the mirror one morning, in order to fix my hair, before going out. It was just an ordinary moment, a habit, a need to paint a picture of myself so it could be presented (in a “proper manner”) to the outside world. As I struggled to tame the unwanted curl, a suspended moment occurred ... Thinking of it today I know it emerged from the infinite place where Time and Space are One! ... my arm dropped down, curl sprang back ... I begun to stare at the image in front of me ... I saw a face looking back ... two faces against each other ... two intruders, face to face ...both in awe. I have no idea for how long I stood there! ... I saw a stranger in the mirror watching me, robbing me of my identity ... then, a question bonded both images: “ Who am I? “ Subsequently, another question aroused: “Who are You?” then ...” Who are we?” .. . “Who am I?” ... oh, those words ... I - am - who ... am - I - Who ...I WHO ARE ... white noise around me... all those words with no meaning just used to shape, to capture, to conjure, to question ... What came next is not easy to describe, but I will try ... ... I felt my ears melted, and at the top of my head a geyser of energy surged, as if someone removed a cork! All of a sudden I felt as if my conciseness expanded, as if a person that stared back at me - somehow merged with me ... I saw reflection disappearing, edges softening, everything becoming a shadow of itself. Then... nothing! I kept starring at nothing. There was no mirror, there was no wall, no unwanted curl, no face, no” I “... A feeling of great presence in the moment occurred, a moment of expansion beyond this dense matter ... where a sound of Silence dwells ... where a Rose of Heart opens, where Lotus of Wisdom reigns ... Words cannot describe this state, this Knowing, this Oneness of everything that exists in the Universe. Moments like this are of great importance, for only then I am able to understand the limitations of Ego. Ego belongs to the dense world of matter, Ego needs gratification, satisfaction, Ego is judgmental, seeks power, seeks the Illusion ... I disliked its qualities at the beginning, desperately trying to push this monster down the cliff ... but, the harder I tried, the more difficult it was to brake the bondage. Then, I took a different approach in my life towards Ego, decided to step aside and just observe, notice when, how and why Ego would manifest itself ... after becoming aware of Ego’s presence, the best thing one can do is just to let it dissolve in its own limitation ... For Ego is limited ... it prevents Consciousness, our Pure Soul, our True Self to reach the Source, the Infinite Beginning of All, God, Creator, Logos, the Only One ... Love! Does not matter how we call this – it is ALL ONE! Is baby’s first cry after being born into this world a result of a great separation from the Ocean of Love we all came from? Who knows, maybe it is so! For me, Ego is not only a limitation, but a great teacher as well. It has been given to me when my soul signed a contract to come and have this human experience. We keep coming over and over again encased in bodies and in self - indulging Ego, till we understand that the reflection in the mirror is not our essence. “ To die before you die” has been a goal of many great mystics regardless of their religion. This allows Soul to come to the Well of Wisdom. Isn’t this the most beautiful thing of all – we can choose different paths, but ultimately we all eventually arrive to the Source, to the ONE LOVE! And as for myself - I still have a long way to go, for I am not the awakened one, trust me on this! But I have been humbled by those moments of Great Dissipation, as they keep showing me how there is no other death but the Death of Ego. We have always been, and we will continue to be, as many of you have already said in this thread. So, let us keep shining! Thank you all for reading this, something told me I have to share it. Dear Chris (greybeard)... thank you one more time for allowing all of us to express our views on the purpose of Ego. I LOVE YOU ALL, BEAUTIFUL SOULS! AND I DO MEAN THIS! In Love and Light :wub2: Astra |
Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend?
Dear Astra
It is I who need to thank you. I am really moved by the way you express your experience so beautifully and with humility. Please keep contributing as you feel inclined to do so. These shared experience encourage all. With much love Chris |
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Your beautifull story Astra brought these words to my mind ..
What you are looking for is what is looking. -St. Francis of Assisi Love from me :wub2: mudra |
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Thank you dear mudra :wub2:and :wub2:Chris! :wub2:
Kind words can be short and easy to speak, but their echoes are truly endless. Mother Teresa in Love and Light Yours Astra |
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Kind words thoughts and deeds are so important. The ego is basically selfish and every selfless action automatically reduces its illusory hold one one. Would any one else like to share their spiritual experience as Astra has done. Every such awareness of the Presence within is encouraging to self and others, Take one step towards God and He takes a hundred towards us. We have to make the effort, Grace is always available. Any reader of this thread on the Advaita path (Non-duality) ? Chris Namaste |
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There is so many thoughts on what enlightenment is that I thought it best to get it straight from the one who is in such a state.
There are levels of enlightenment and after fully transcending the ego this is an account of the final state copied from the book "I Reality and Subjectivity" by Dr David Hawkins MD Ph.D "Suddenly without warning, a shift in awareness occurred and the Presence totally prevailed, unmistakable and all encompassing. There were a few moments of intense apprehension as the self died, and then the absoluteness of the Presence inspired a flash of awe. This breakthrough was spectacular and more intense than anything before. It had no counterpart in ordinary experience. The profound shock was was cushioned by the love that is the Presence. Without the support and protection of that love, it seems that one would be annihilated. There followed a moment of terror as the ego clung to its existence, fearing it would become nothingness. Instead, as it died, it was replaced by the Self as Everythingness, the All in which everything was known and obvious in its perfect expression of its own essence. With non-locality came the awareness that one is all that ever was or can be. One is total and complete, beyond all identities, beyond gender, beyond even humanness itself. One need never again fear suffering and death. What happened to the body beyond this point is immaterial. At certain level of spiritual awareness, ailments of the body heal or spontaneously disappear, but in the Absolute state such considerations are irrelevant. The body will run its predicted course and then return from whence it came. Its a matter of no importance, Reality is unaffected. The body is an it rather than a me; just another object like furniture in a room. It may seem comical that people still address the body as though it were an individual you, but there is no way to explain this state of awareness to the unaware. It is best to just go about ones business and allow providence to handle the social adjustment. However as one reaches bliss, it is very difficult to conceal that state of intense ecstasy. in this final apocalypse of the self, the dissolution of the sole remaining duality of existence versus non existence dissolves in Universal Divinity and no individual consciousness is left to chose. The last step, then, is taken by God." Chris |
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Best regards, |
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Especially if one begins to play out a healing or teaching role, then the ego must be operating on a higher harmonic if at all. Gosh, even being a parent can bring one to egolessness :original: peace, Gnosis |
Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend?
IMO I think one way people can transcend spiritually and mentally if they are able to come to recognize their own shortcomings and how vastly ignorant we all are of almost everything. I don't mean it in an "ignorance is bliss" sort of way, just that, generally speaking, humans are not the apex of biological or technological evolution we think we are at. We are ignorant of so many things its rather unfathomable. We have not even begun the real exploration of our galaxy, as such telescopes can only take us so far, and hence we have a very poor understanding of our existence and purpose, and this gets back to our micro existence on this super macro scale.
Peace and Love will have to do for now. :original: |
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If one wishes to dig deeper intellectually, but not necessarily experientially, here is a good article:
Sandorian Grove Blog RE Ego Types |
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Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend?
I thought I would share and experience I had about ten years ago.
I have written a little about Kundalini a couple of pages back but I dident share the experience, so here goes. At that time I was mainly reading Ramana as it was difficult to get books by europeans who are enlightened. Anyway I began to experience intense itching in the scalp, a pulling at the third eye and when listening to Bajhans in the half lotus position all of a sudden my upper body began to rotate in a clockwise direction, my head almost brushing the floor,I stopped it and it started going the other way. I had no idea what was happening I got in touch with a friend who had been a spiritual student much longer than I and he sugested getting in touch with a friend of his Desmond. Desmond sent me info on Kundalini awakening and I had quite a few of the symptoms, some mentioned. I ended up going to a 14 day meditation intensive on the late Guruji's ashram in India, One night we, about 40 of us were chanting 108 Om's and I noticed the person beside was in an estatic state, big smile and tears rolling down his face. I thought "nothing like that ever happens to me!!!" Well next morning we were again doing the Om's and all of a sudden Love hiit me, I have never experienced anything like it in my life. I felt so loved the tears were streaming down. I looked at the others, I was at the very back and I felt such love for all of them. I felt I was cuddling them. I was in a state of bliss for about 2 days. A few days after the initial experience, I heard a lady say that she felt she was being cuddled at the time I was having the experience. A little later in a personal interview Guruji gave Shaktipat ( The guru blesses you at the same time as he is touching your forehead) and confirmed that Kundalini awakened. When I got home I tried to put it down to emotionalism or the power of the ashram, No it happened again sitting in my living room. Im not going to say too much about Kundalini as its a massive subject. Siddis occour, They are gifts from God but not to become attached to them. One instance I will speak of. I was at my Aunts funeral, she made it to 95, an old friend of hers who had been very kind to her was siting beside me, I felt a love for her, all of a sudden a surge of energy passed out of my side. I never said anything but after the service Lorna said to me that she had experienced energy coming into her from me. She was a nursing sister and very grounded. Anyway a few weeks later she told me that she had been due to have a serious operation to her spine and when they did a pre operation check the surgeon could find nothing wrong with her. I was just a channel for that healing, there have been others but I am well aware its not me doing it. I cant make it happen. Chris Namaste |
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Thank you for sharing this experience Chris .
I believe it was a truly blissfull one .. One that those around you could feel and be blessed by . Joy you have to share; blissfulness you need not share — it simply surrounds you. Whoever is courageous enough to come close to you will have it. Bliss is not something that you have to do anything about; it is already there around you, it is your milieu. The blissful person — you can call him the awakened, the enlightened, you can give any name… the blissful person is simply showering his bliss continuously. Whoever is thirsty can drink of it. Osho Love from me mudra |
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this impossible rotation of the body within the body the quick revolving clockwise and anticlockwise motion cast me out of the still not sleeping body in bed but all of me was outside the physical body because of experience the body is for me a shell for me living within it Death where is your Sting the body becomes a habit but it is a habitat for the Soul the Source and Substance of the Soul is the Supreme Spirit 1 quarter of this Supreme Spirit makes up All That Is the rest 3 quarters the bigger portion It Is Itself I Am That I Am |
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As all-ways thank you for your contributions Mudra and RedeZra.
much appreciated. Chris Namaste |
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This question was asked of Dr David Hawkins in the book "I ----chapter On the way of the heart"
Q: How can one prevent the development of a spiritual ego? Each success seems like it would feed into it. A: "Realize that there is no such entity as the doer of deeds or actions. There is no doer/self to take to take blame or credit. Progress is the result of a quality of consciousness that has been activated by the assent of the spiritual will. Spiritual inspiration becomes the energy that is operating. It does not eminate from ego/self. The Self, like the divinity of God does not "do" anything, nor does it 'act' or 'perform' or 'intend' or 'chose'. for it is beyond all volition. The manifestation of God as Existence is void of conditions or positionalities. The purity of Divinity is beyond comprehension by the ego because ego is limited to form and always asumes a duality of subject and object. That which is the Unlimited nonlinear Reality is not divisible and is beyond the subject/object duality of the ego's conceptions based on positionality. All spiritual progress is a gift, and humble gratitude precludes pride." Chris says. At first it is difficult to wrap ones head around the concept of non-duality but bit by bit the clarity of Hawkins teaching drops in. One without a second as spoke of by spiritual mystics is an absolute truth. Only God is, and we are That. more from Dr David Hawkins. Enlightenment means that the former personal identity and all that had been believed about have been erased, removed, dissolved, and displaced. The particular has been replaced by the universal, qualities have been replaced by essence, the linear has been replaced by the nonlinear, and the discrete has been replaced by the unlimited. position in time or place has become Allness and Foreverness. Intention has been replaced by spontaneity, and the limiting perception of duality has been removed as the Radiance of Oneness illuminates the Reality and the Truth of nonduality. The essence of Divinity stands forth in its Self-revelation. Mentation has ceased and in the Silence, the Knowingness of Omniscience radiates forth unasked. Emotion has been replaced by Peace. The exquisite gentleness of Infinite Power is deftly soft and invisible because it is the very Source and substrate of all that appears to exist. By analogy, it is like a shadow which is replaced by a sunbeam. The shadow does not become the sunbeam. Chris |
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such a beautiful thread, THANK U!
~ love in you ~ |
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Hello again loves on this oasis in the desert thread.
I posted this on another thread, but thought it should go here too. The Ego http://www.bbc5.tv/eyeplayer/video/ego Love, Kriya |
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Thanks Kriya.
This is the place -- smiling Love Eckhart Chris |
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Who gets the fact that the world you perceive is actually the simulation constructed by your brain-mind system and not the real world itself? If you do are you consciously aware that the monitor that you think you're reading this off of right now is constructed of your own brain-stuff and is in fact just as much YOU as your 'awareness' of it is? In becoming aware that the world that you experience and the experienced self (the appearance of your body, all your physical sensations and inner dialog) are the one in the same brain-mind thing you can 'transcend' the egos illusionary existence. Everything remains the same however you will no longer see things quite the same again until your human nature over-rides your insight and you once again think of the world your perceive of as the real world rather than your mind itself. Or so it seems to me.
Oddly enough my avatar is an attempt by me to illustrate the above facts. The gray body and leaf are in the "real world" on the other side of our senses. We never experience them. We experience the leaf, body, and awareness that our mind simulates represented by the colorful bubble on the guys shoulders. The real world and self and the experienced world and self are two completely different things in substance, form, and location. The real world contains all dimensions and matter. The experienced world is restricted to 3 dimensions (which may or may not exist in the real world) and the chromatic and auditory portrayal (which certainly exists only in the perceiving mind) of a limited section of what we understand as the electromagnetic spectrum. When I actually realized this I had one of those laughing, crying, weird experiences people sometimes refer to as a spiritual experience. It was quite a profound and mind altering thing. |
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Thanks for your visit. My avatar picture is Ramana Mahrshi who said. "The world you are trying to save dosent even exist" Our perception is just that, perception. Dr Hawkins says " All thought are falacious" Course in Miracles says. " The moment you take up a position know that you are identifying with an illusion" The ego has created a world of illusion -- duality, Truth is only God is. Dr Hawkins had the biggest Psychiatry practice in America so he knows the mechanism of the mind. He is also interested in Quantum Mechanics so his knowlege is wide based. If intellect appeals to you I suggest you get his book "Power versus Force" even if you are not much interested in God its a fascinating read. His use of language is exquisite. Regards Chris |
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greybeard,
While the experienced world can indeed be proven to be a neurological illusion the fact that the real world does exist on the other side of our senses is also true and shouldn't be discounted. Our minds have evolved to present the real world to us in a manner suited to our survival. We can be assured that our actions within the simulations of the world we call our minds impact the real world and the other beings living in it with us. We simultaneously live in the real world and a world of illusion. Two different realities effecting each other yet of different substance, existing in a different place, and occurring at a different time. Human beings can truly be called multi-dimensional beings. We live in one dimension and we experience it in a totally different one. |
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Honestly if you read the work of Dr Hawkins you will find he is saying much the same as you. Ramana's comments did not deny that there is a real world its just that the unenlightened does not see it for reasons you have given. An enlightened sage sees the world totally differently. Regards Chris |
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It is in the nature of the ego find what it is looking for.
Everything that is contrary to its point of view is ignored discarded as irrelevant. Contrary information is sometimes not even noticed consciously as the brain has an automatic filter process. The statement "Love is blind" springs to mind - The love at first sight--- the honeymoon period then what? Eckhat Tolle says "Dont take your thoughts too seriously" I wouldent take feelings that serious either. There are times when extreme discretion is required. An Anchor may be necessary The ego will happily lead you into drama regardless of true or false. In extreme cases the ego would rather let you die than admit error or kill countless others. Wars are fought over a point of view. Still I believe that we are coming to a point in the evolution of man kind where love and harmony will prevail. I can of course find evidence for that thought.:mfr_lol: Chris Chris |
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Dr. David R. Hawkins
I posted a part of Bio of Dr Hawkins who is my main teacher as it helps to put some of my postings this thread into context. Regards Chris Biography Summary Sir David R. Hawkins, M.D., Ph.D. is a nationally renowned psychiatrist, physician, researcher, spiritual teacher and lecturer. He co-authored the ground-breaking work, Orthomolecular Psychiatry with Nobel Laureate Linus Pauling, that helped revolutionize psychiatry.The uniqueness of Dr. Hawkins' work is that an individual of advanced spiritual consciousness also possesses the intellect and clarity to express and communicate the characteristics of these highly–evolved states of awareness that few have experienced. He established the Pathway of Devotional Nonduality – a direct course to Enlightenment via clarification of core essentials that merely await activation by decision, intention, and dedication of the will. His book, "Discovery of the Presence of God: Devotional Nonduality," is basically an instruction manual for the serious spiritual devotee, revealing information that is known only by those who have transcended the ego to reach Divine Realization. |
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I finally got down to watching it, I was amazed at the depth of comment on the ego and the quality of those speaking on it. Rare to find such a jem on mainstream TV. People are becoming aware. Regards Chris Also includes a clip from the film "Revolver." |
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Good morning.
"Hell is the other" thats a famous quote, Why is it important to transcend the ego? Every dispute from the minor at home or work. Every major personal or world wide fall out is down to ego. My needs wants or desires first. I will do whatever it takes to get my way. I know best/ I am right -- you are wrong. No negotiation unless!!!!! No compromise. Whenever a position is taken up it creates the opposite point of view. All of these are down to the ego wanting its own way. Me and the enemy out there. Them an us. All duality. We cant have the ego and peace and harmony. Its that simple. It is just not possible. So yes transcending the ego is that important. if this has caught you attention please go back to page one and work your way through. There are a lot of very good contributions. When the ego is transcended what is left, Why you are. Free from bondage. The need to be right. many other things sort thems elves out. You sre still a unique individual. Look at a great orchestra. Many instruments, many musicians, beautiful harmonies. exciting moving performance. One composer. When all are aligned with the composer the Creator then we have harmony, we have single-mindedness, common purpose. yet we can have different orchestras throughout the world playing the same melody and it is unique, yet the harmony is there. Musicians can go from one orchestra to another and the music is subtle changed yet the melody remains. Who wants peace and harmony? Not the ego. Not really. It wants excitement. This moment is boring I want the next whats new!!!! Where is it? The ego is is transcended by being in the "NOW" By reading Eckhart Tolle. Dr David Hawkins, those who are in an egoless state. With Love Chris |
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Great thread - Greybeard and all contributors...
I'm only up to about page 7... will have to do this in two hits... but just want to say how much I am enjoying it so far. So many great contributions and points of view, I would like to comment on them all (Get Back in the box , KP's EGO ! :original:) So instead I'll just transcend all that and say Thank You All. It's not a very long journey, the present is here already :wink2: K |
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My ego is still work in progress but there is a massive improvement in my life now I know what its up to, I dont have knee jerk reactions to events and people, now, I have choice to react or not and if I do react then its a much more friendly response. We run here there and everywhere. Does it really matter whether or not there was an earth quake in China for example? Yes it matters very much to the Chinese. It matters to the people of Haiti but I cant do anything about something that dosent affect me personally except donate, pray for the people suffering have compassion and I do these things. I have the greatest respect for all on this forum and I do realize it is amongst other things a "Whistle Blowers Forum" For myself its priorities. What can I actually do? If I get my self in good order then my world comes right. Its the only world I subjectively know, personally experience. If we all do that its enough. A fairly well known story. A man was too busy to play with his son in spite of Daddie Daddie Daddie!! Play with me. Father in desperation cut a page out of a magazine with a picture of the world on it, tore it into small pieces to form a make do jigsaw puzzle. He said to his son. "When you have put together the map of the world I will play with you. Minutes later son was back job done. Dad was amazed. How did you do that so quickly? Son said. " It was easy dad, on the otherside of the page was the picture of a man, when I got the man right the world came right". With love Chris |
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So not doing that well.. but while there is learning there is hope. Regarding your quote above... this is the change I'm all for and it bemuses me that people worry about the 'details' of whistleblowers and earthquakes, when real change is in our hands every second. I'm not saying I'm good at this but I'm convinced it's the way forward... Of course..that's just my ego's point of view. I have to accept that a world is everything... K |
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Chris |
Re: The ego what is it? How to transcend?
"No self no problem."
Quoted answer that Eckhart got when he asked a Buddhist Monk to sum up Buddhism. Its that simple no duality - no ego - no problem. Simple but not easy. Chris |
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Think one of the classic "death of the ego" stories comes from the "Power of Now"
Eckart Tolle shares in the book how life had got to the point that he could no longer live with himself. When that though arose the question also arose. I can no longer live with my self so are there two of me? A self that can no longer live with self? At that point came a realization that he was not the miserable entity, a moment of fear followed and he remembered little of what came after that but when he awoke the whole world looked totally different. Peace had replaced turmoil, his mind was virtually silent. We transcend ego and our world will look totally different, our perception will have altered. Is it worth it to do what it takes to let go of ego? I think so. With love Chris |
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Hi
If this is the first time youve looked at this thread please start at page one. There are lot of interesting contributions, speaking of which. I would really appreciate the sharing of experiences that have occurred during meditation or spontaneously. Thanking you in advance. Chris |
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There is no way to happiness, happiness is the way. You should be happy right in the here and now. There is no way to enlightenment. Enlightenment should be right here and right now. The moment when you come back to yourself, mind and body together, fully present, fully alive, that is already enlightenment. You are no longer a sleepwalker. You are no longer in a dream. You are fully alive. You are awake. Enlightenment is there. And if you continue each moment like that, enlightenment becomes deeper. More powerful. There is no way to enlightenment, enlightenment is the way. vietnamese zen buddhist monk - thich nhat hanh - 2007 Love Always mudra |
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Nice to see you here Illuminate.
Some great inspiring videos about these days. I really believe that we are on the verge of amazing things just a question of being present in the moment and being kind to all life including our own and letting it happen. Oh a thought. One time I was mulling over a "problem" and what would I do. Great insecurity and fear of the future I just didnt know what to do. One of my friends said. "Do you think God dosent know what you are going to do next?" "Why not ask Him?" There is enormous depth in that statement. I was running programmed at that time virtually everyone else had a fair idea of what I would do given my past history, I was in avoidance of what is my true nature and the freedom therein. Now I just let go of the "problem" (surrender to what is) and most times it seems to come right without my interference. "God grant me the serentity to ccept the things I cannot change. The courage to change the things I can Wisdom to know the difference." While I am reminiscing. As a child I spent a fair amount of time in hospital. This time I had just come out of hospital after bursting my spleen in a sledging accident, I was eleven at the time. I was having a good old moan to my Dad. oh woe is me!!! laughing. He was silent for a moment or two then said. "Reflect not upon your past misfortunes of which you have had a few but reflect upon your present blessings of which there are many." With love Chris |
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A litle humor ;)
Ego http://www.chakra.org/living/dharma%20the%20cat.jpg Dharma the Cat says: humans tend to miss the point . Love Always mudra |
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